John McCain: 300 Economists Support My Economic Plan...NOT!!
By SilentPatriot Saturday Jul 12, 2008 8:30amSam Graham-Felsen of myBarackObama.com writes in:
For the third time in two days, Senator McCain repeated the false claim that his economic plan has been endorsed by 300 economists.
FACT: Many of the 300 economists don't support McCain's whole economic agenda. On Monday, John McCain's campaign released a statement signed by 300 economists who "enthusiastically support" his "Jobs for America" economic plan, providing a heavyweight testimonial to the presumptive Republican nominee's "broad and powerful economic agenda." There's just one problem. Upon closer inspection, it seems a good many of those economists don't actually support the whole of McCain's economic agenda. And at least one doesn't even support McCain for president. In interviews with more than a dozen of the signatories, Politico found that, far from embracing McCain's economic plan, many were unfamiliar with - or downright opposed to - key details. [Politico, 7/9/08, http://www.politico.com/news/
stories/0708/11618.html] FALSE McCAIN CLAIM: "And by the way my economic plan has been signed on to by 5 Nobel laureates and by over 300 economists, so I have my own supporters as well and again the Congressional Budget Office and others of do their calculations on static economic conditions, i don't except that." [McCain tele-town hall, 7/10/08]
FALSE McCAIN CLAIM: "Our economic plan has been supported by 300 economists and five Nobel laureates." [McCain avail, 7/9/08]
FALSE McCAIN CLAIM: "I'm saying that there is five Nobel laureates and 300 economists who think my economic plan is a good one." [CBS Evening News, 7/9/08]
When John McCain and reality square off, reality wins. Every time.
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Only greedy evil bastards and complete morons support republican economics!
That's what happens when you join the Republican party, you loose all sense of facts and values.
But at this point in his life I think McNugget has simply lost his sense.
NoGWBpolicyleftinplace @ 1:
You need to pick up a copy of Atlas Shrugged and really read it, NoGWBpolicyleftinplace. Expand your horizons.
{ Deleted, Off Topic. Take it to an open thread. SiteMonitor}
And NO News groups are carrying this?
I don't know if you take advise from Canadians but I truly believe that Obama is the candidate of change but these blogs haven't changed one bit. There isn't even one article on the positive things that Obama has done only negative articles on McCain. Forget him and focus on the great things that Obama is going to do. Don't be the same politics of the past and be the politics of the future. Make McCain irrelevant.
A politician who is lying? Who'd a thunk it?
I don't support John McCain or his policies but I have a question. Why, if they don't support his policies, did these "5 Nobel laureates and over 300 economists" sign his release of said policies?? Sounds like these people hold the same principles and integrity as our Democratic (and Republican) nominees, Senators and representatives that say they support rule of law and the Constitution and then vote in support of ignoring the same. This country truly is F*%#^!, and needs a revolution, not an election to fix it. Anything else is just delaying it's inevitable downfall.
Damn them kids' internets. What happened to the days when a senator could lie like a gentleman and get some belief for it.
Canadian Debby -- Well, what _has_ Obama done as a senator? Didn't filibuster FISA, was AWOL for some votes, I believe he has consistently supported the Iraq war by "supporting the troops" with continued funding. He has not and is never calling for a Canadian-style universal health care. Maybe he has to run away from the image of Jesse Jackson to get elected, but, generally, he's been rather slick at playing the "middle-of-the-road" politician as "middle-of-the-road" has been defined in 21st century U.S.
But, yes, we probably should talk more about various things he has done outside the halls of congress that _might_ indicate he really has the character to change America as president. Telling the Party that lobbyist money wasn't welcome was a good start.
from the upcoming Grampa McNasty movie '300 Days of the Reagan impersonator'
'Tonight we eat caviar, tomorrow we dine on dogfood'
Many of those economistas thought the Bush economic plan, beginning in 2001, was great, too. Look where *that's* gotten us. Frankly, I say, let him have 'em. Let's get to the debates!
☻..Bangkok Bob..☻ @ 5:
only local ones, the cable news and mainstream will avoid it like the plague and go to the next McBBQ with a clear conscience.
they must put some good CIA approved meds in them there hotdogs and burgers.
Its also Bohemian grove week too, so a slow news cycle, expect Snow tears and missing white kids to dominate the news.
Yeah yeah, but will the corporate media report this? You already know the answer -- they continue to let the War Hero get away with everything, airbrush all his lies out of existence, make one quick obligatory mention of his monumental screwups and then send them down the memory hole -- and it's going to be that way right through November. It isn't going to change. You can keep preaching to the converted here all you want, but the reality of John McCain is never going to be presented on the teevee, with just enough of an exception on Countdown to keep y'all deceived about what's going on in the zeitgeist.
smchris @ 9:
In other words, he's a typical politician, right? Sigh. That's really too bad. I for one, had hoped finally a decent Prez would come along instead of some slick snake oil salesman. Guess there aren't any, anywhere on the globe.
My friends, none of this matters. It is important to remember that I am a war hero who was tortured while a POW. Also, I am a flying ace, having downed five aircraft. My friends, Barack Hussein Obama is an arab negro who wants our women. God bless America! (cue Star Spangled Banner)
I wanna see McCain's Florida and Alalabama henchmen
BobBog Allen andTroyBoy King doing a commercial for McNasty,that would be a sight to see. Crist and Lieberman get supporting roles.
McCain-Gramm economic plan lifted from Marie Antoinette. They should have read a little bit more and found out the end wasn't that great
McCain is a LIAR, CHEATER and HYPOCRITE.
He has about as much credibility as Bush. In other words, ZERO.
Why doesn't the msm ever report McShame's many, many lies? They treat him just like the old, senile man that he is and smile knowingly and say grandpa doesn't realize what he is saying. And he thinks he is a hero so just let an old man believe what he wants. The rest of us don't have to believe it. Well, anyone who knows better doesn't believe it. Sadly some don't know any better. Msm for example, Lieberman, Graham.
Reality wins logical debates, but not elections. I thought we all knew that by now?
“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it”
“How fortunate for leaders that men do not think.”
“The victor will never be asked if he told the truth.”
As true in the early part of the 20th Century as it is today...
No worries, turns out you can fix everything, just by suing Norway.
In early 2001, the Saudi Arabian minister for oil and energy travelled the globe to gather support from oil producing nations to decrease production to get the price up from USD 10,- a gallon, (as they were seriously screwed and in national debt at the time, he actually followed our minister(secretary to you I think) to my town, from the capital in order to discuss this, as our minister was here on a visit).
Most nations agreed to a production cut, oil price went a little up, 9/11 happened, and oil production was maxed out again(not entirely sure when), and some lawyers in Florida are doing a class action suit against Norway, Mexico and Angola, because we cooperated with Opec in this matter, and floridian car owners had to pay more than necessary due to the price cooperation, back in 2001.
They are apparently not suing Opec/Saudi Arabia for some reason, hmm.
I guess we are forced to produce all out oil at a loss when oil price is at 10 USD a barrel, and the cost for drilling out on the open sea is higher. Especially since we are indeed responsible for keeping all american motorists with cheap gas, when we pay USD 8 a gallon of gasoline. (10 $/gallon now)
What is a little extortion among friends anyway.
dennis @ 3:
I don't need to read propoganda from anyone, least of all republican imbeciles!
I have lived the republican experience far beyond what your single digit I.Q. could ever comprehend! The fact that you are so cluelessly stupid and hopelessly ignorant after the latest republican assault on America, tells me everything I need to know about you!
Expand all of our horizons on C & L, and STFU! I am tired of morons like you trying to defend the indefensible as though you have something of value to say.
My first post says it all! If you have any disagreement with it, you are a clueless, nonperceptive idiot. You are the type who could walk into a snow blizzard, and be convinced by republicans to buy a bathing suit because its really hot outside. Don't think for yourself, read what the republican said; its hot outside.
Go condescend to someone lower on the evolutionary scale than you are. Like Red State.
USD 10 a barrel for oil of course.
It Ain't Half Hot (in Alabama and Florida) log cabins
a sneak peak at the RNC lineup for September when the Repugs finally proudly come out of the closet.
theWalrus @ 11:
I'm sure Larry "Nostradamus" Kudlow signed it too!
I never took an economics class in college, but I have been consistently more correct in my predictions over recent years than almost everyone of the so-called economists on T.V. They don't know their ass from a hole in the ground! Getting an economics degree, is like getting a degree in reading fortune telling!
This is very similar to the Intelligent Design proponents' claims that over "700 scientists" agree with them. Then, you talk to different scientists and find that they don't actually agree. Seems to be a rightwing way of arguing.
CujoInNC @ 8:
I'm sure, in a nation of 300,000,000, they could find 300 repugnantcants who would want to lower taxes and balance the budget.
It really sounds like McCains letter was very general in it's content. Some of the recipients didn't even read it but liked McCain.
Okay DampFOX, you have convinced us! We're all going to sit at home reading "Atlas Shrugged" on election day, let McInsane win the election. Then we'll read the BuyBull until McNero flips out and pushes the button. We'll be
rupturedraptured to Gloryland and live happily ever after, worldwithout endoops... amen.Another day for MC Bullshit and the Crooked Crap Express.
☻..Bangkok Bob..☻ @ 5:
No, it appears that Angelina Jolie's and Brad Pitt's new baby was more important. The MSM---what a joke.
What ever McCain is offering it will be far better than the massive tax hike Obama and Rangel will push though...
Time for... an appropriate picture!
What's to report? These 300 clowns signed on to a statement supporting McCain's economic plan, many of them without having read the whole thing. Of course McCain is going to hold this up as an endorsement of his plan, even if many of the economists express reservations when pressed about it after the fact.
In my eyes, the folks who signed the statement without really thinking about what they were signing is the sad part. (You're an Obama supported, and now you think maybe you shouldn't have rushed to sign on?? Schmuck.) But who can blame McCain for taking advantage of it?
liberAL @ 19:
I wish we would see MSM covering some of this, but I'm not holding my breath. In my small town I've been watching the McCain signs go up in the yards of our local lawyers and business owners - upper middle class republicans, every one. Mr. G and I like to refer to them as the local royals. They're lawyers, accountants, and second generation owners of businesses. Most came from upper middle class backgrounds in this town. Unbearable snobs and bastards, every one. They don't really care what happens to this country as long as they can still drive the Escalade and spend summers at the lake house.
Unfortunately we live in a neighborhood of older homes and are surrounded by local royalty. In 2004 we proudly put our democratic candidate's signs in our front yard only to have them stolen on a weekly basis. We caught the kids who did it (daddy owns an insurance agency) and the police refused to do anything with it even though they were trespassing and stealing according to city ordinance. Maybe MSM coverage of the lies would help if they kept reporting and didn't give McCain a pass, but I'm pretty sure my neighbors still think Bush is one heck of a guy....
the "300", the courageous, the patriotic: the "300"
i bet the fictitious (and hunky!) "300" could also kick ass too!
i see the persian forces (or, iranians, or mccain critics, whichever) trying to force their unholy, ungodly, barbarous and evil ways (see, regulations, see oversight, see reform) on the poor people of sparta (or america, whichever), with only the brave "300", with the 6-packed, stout and determined mccain at their lead. fight 'em in the shade general mccain!!!!
how could you guys NOT be inspired by this? i am pumped enough to go out and privatize the street in front of my house. toll please! *grabby hand*
/snark off
redwhite&blue @ 31:
Gosh, how well you back up that position. What intensive research. What an irrefutable conclusion you draw. Are you the reincarnation of Chanakya? You are, aren't you. Come on, admit it.
I can see why the economists have reservations about some points in McCain's plan. This is the second time I have read it and the plan still has no substance to it. Its just vague promises followed the Government stepping to cover losses. I mean, here are just a few of the questions I have:
McCain feels that by simply telling oil speculators and oil exporting nations that our dependance on oil will come end that this will somehow bring prices down. How? At the end of the day Americans are still going to drive their vehicles to work and so on while the U.S. still imports that same oil. Everyone knows that. That is not a plan.
Then, you have McCain's comprehensive spending controls that really are a joke. He says he is going to reserve all savings from the Iraq and Afghanistan "victories" to reducing the deficit. What reserves!? Define victory!?
Then, McCain wants to cut all non-defense non-discretionary spending for an entire year? Yea, like that one is going fly!
McCain's plan was a joke when I first read it and it remains so today.
dennis @ 3:
Even John Galt would give up on laissez-faire capitalism if he could see the destruction wrought by the unbridled greed and shortsightedness of our financial community. Ben Bernanke recently said that more regulation and oversight is needed in their industry. No kidding, genius. Guess that anti regulation Reagan "Revolution" paradigm is just another failed Republican pipe dream. When you guys have another idea like this one you want to try out---do us a favor. Keep it to yourself. We don't need any more of your mind expanding adventures.
It would have been paying attention you would have heared Obama promising everything under sun to the American people, healthcare, education, tax breaks. Rangel has already staetd he wants to raise taxes!!! Its the main problem with the Democratic party, its all they know, just alittle bit more money and one more government program and everything will be okay!
Loonie @ 36:
dennis @ 3:
ah, yes, the suggestion from dennis to read a work of fiction as a way to understand the economic devastation that is so real to those suffering from the economic ideology espoused in this, again, work of fiction.
and, to understand terrorism: watch 24, bwhahahaha
suggestion for you, dennis: read something non-fictional about the economy and the condition the 'cult of the individual' has left us in. that is, if you aren't scared to.
sorry, but greed is not something i worship like the object from LedZep's Presence....
Joe O. @ 37:
There's a saying that an idea without a plan is probably a hallucination. Welcome to the Mc Cain economic idea for paying off the national debt. Pay off our debt by winning the Iraq war that has cost us over a trillion and a half dollars already? John, you better lay off the LSD.
McCain seems to me to always talk as if he has no idea what he is talking about. Even at his town hall events McCain seems to ramble on and when he does state a fact it is often proven to be false later.
Gretchen @ 34:
LiberAl@ 19 That is not what the corporate sponsors of the MSM pay them for. Everything is blacked out unless it supports the Military/Corporate/ProfitMedia.
Gretchen @ 34. Sorry to hear that. In McSame's Arizona on the westside of Phoenix I have seen only one McSame bumpersticker and 0 McSame yard signs - though it is still early in the election. So-called conservatives have HAD IT with McSame. I've seen a number of Obama bumperstickers and signs. Not scientific, just mildly interesting. Of course, I haven't been to
MormonMesa lately.redwhite&blue @ 39:
good morning Rumpelstiltskin, how was your nap?
redwhite&blue @ 39:
Bad air, I smell troll. Ugh,bad.
redwhite&blue @ 31:
Aha---another dupe who believes the Politburo propaganda that taxation is evil. If you think that's true then try Republican voodoo economics that boldly states that we can have massive spending increases, no increase in debt, and pay off any debt we have incurred today in four years---while decreasing or flat lining the amount of revenue we take in.
Republicans have gotten a lot of mileage off the anti tax mantra and look what it has brought us---record deficits that are an IOU to our future.
Try this genius model yourself and validate your own proposition. See you in Chapter 7.
Economists are one step below meteorologists on the "know-nothing-but-anything-works" scale.
Mickxotic @ 43:
Good news about Phoenix. As for us, we plan to do the same thing with our signs this fall as we did this spring with the IMPEACH sign. Attach it to the house. So far the little bastards haven't been able to do anything about that, but one did call me a "commie" last week. I doubt that he's smart enough to know that one on his own so he must have heard it from his dad.
Loonie @ 32:
hee hee, i didn't see this before my post...
good p'shoppin'!
I see no one here wants to have an intelligence debate on the issues, just attack attack attack, not surpised. Sorry guys, blaming the big bad corps is not going to cut it. We need to come together in a bi-partisian way, without all the name calling to solve Americas problem. Will you join me!?
Ron @ 45:
redwhite&blue @ 50:
No problem there RWB. We'll be waiting. However, don't expect your anti tax mantra to get any traction here.
redwhite&blue @ 39:
After the massive transfer from the public treasury to crony corporations and lobbyists, capital will be needed for legitimate projects and operations. It is called "being responsible and paying your bills," something that deadbeats and Repugnicans don't understand. Yeah, yeah; I know: why should I have to pay for anything? It is really too bad that we don't have a policy whereby deadbeats can legally refuse to pay their taxes in exchange for not accepting any services. That way, when your child gets hit by a car, you won't have to worry about getting any expensive and unwanted help from paramedics or other socialist weasels. You can have inscribed on your child's gravestone -
He died with low taxes
The idiot population dwindles - everybody wins!
Free market capitalism would have worked if we ever gave it a chance. Now it's too late since the big boys are far too big for little companies to compete. But if we didn't have corporate citizenship (can we repeal the 14th amendment yet?) and if we didn't have corporate welfare, I still believe that free market capitalism would have worked and we wouldn't have the multinational conglomerates we do today.
The downside is that smaller companies can't provide the economies of scale large one can, so one immediate example is that you would have to take several small airlines to get from one side of the country to the other, rather than one non-stop flight. But on the upside, I bet the costs would have been cheaper with more competition in the market place, even if you had to buy 5 tickets to get from NY to CA.
But even if you disagree that free market capitalism is beneficial, what other option do we have? We currently have corporate plutocracy as our economic system, socialism is not politically viable, communism is completely out of the question for the same reason, mercantilism has long been discredited and would just mean more wars of occupation to secure resources, barter and trade would be unwieldy considering the sheer number of transactions we require each day. We could try to create a new economic system, but what would it look like?
At the end of the day, we still need to get rid of the 14th amendment. It served its noble purpose at the time of its ratification, it is no longer needed and only serves to grant rights to corporations that the founders never intended.
See the following for more information as to how the 14th amendment grants corporate citizenship:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Clara_County_vs._Southern_Pacific_Rai...
The cheese is slipping off his cracker (as per Reagan) and the handlers have taken control of him and his campaign. He isn't campaigning, he is being displayed and sold as a pliable corporate gateway to the biggest barrel of pork in history. Ironically, the real fraud in this year's election isn't the bullshit being passed to the voter since that is the same fraud that happens every election cycle.
No, the real fraud here is being committed against the corporation, because it's only after they buy their way to the barrel that they will discover it is pretty much empty due to the excessive criminal activity of the previous administration(s).
Maybe Obama no longer wants to be president. I wouldn't want the job, the current situation is beyond reconciliation and only a complete collapse (and rebuilding) of the system will fix it. The next president is doomed to 2 choices:
Being in charge while the country does an imitation of the U.S.S.R (total collapse and chaos), or,
Presiding over a citizen revolt against the corrupt-to-the-core government he found himself in charge of. I see it as a no-win situation for the presumptive "winner". Talk about your boobie-prizes.
The people want change, and they want it now. The prez will have to become the middle man in a war between the corporate and the person, and right there you can seen the problem.
The corporate owns the government. The person, to whom the government and corporate are constitutionally mandated to take second place, has more or less been declared an enemy of the state.
If the Prez comes out in favor of the corporate, the money laundering via the national debt and massive corporate fraud (enron, fanny, mac, etc) will not just continue but accelerate until the country is no longer solvent with total collapse being the only possible eventuality.
If he comes out for the person, he will be marginalized via the media over a blowjob (per clinton) or something equally pointless, and the money laundering via the national debt and massive corporate fraud will continue same as above.
A full public revolt against the system is the only solution here. It is time to dissolve a government that is no longer for (or by) the people and invoke the Third Congress.
Bottom line tho, whether you agree with the above or not, is that this shit is all scripted. It is taking advantage of the public addiction to "reality tv", fully aware that "reality" and "tv" are mutually exclusive...
dennis @ 3:
r u 1 of those randians?
Economic conditions for trolls must be bad, Dennis is here early with the 3rd post. Post early, post often, makes republiscum trolls wealthy with their lies.
Debby @ 6:
Maybe you can open that blog you want. Google will help.
BC @ 26:
they know they are lying and they know that the media will never call a repug on the lies.
Why are my comments not posting?
OK, well that worked... Let's try this again:
Grr, I just made a post and it disappeared...
Long story short, I was saying that Free-Market Capitalism would have worked if we ever gave it a chance, but thanks to corporate citizenship granted by the 14th Amendment and endless corporate welfare, it wouldn't work now.
So what sort of economic system should we propose if the current system of corporate plutocracy doesn't work and free market capitalism won't work (until we reduce the size of corporations)? Socialism and communism are not politically viable options, mercantilism has been long discredited and would only require more wars to secure resources. In many ways our current system is sort of like Neo-Corporate Mercantilism...
Anyway, it's time we repeal the 14th amendment as it has served its noble purpose at the time of its ratification. It's continued presence will only serve to further impoverish our nation in favor of the desires of our corporate masters.
For more information as to how the 14th amendment grants corporate citizenship, see here (links to wikipedia).
redwhite&blue @ 50:
First you should come up with something other than the dems want to raise your taxes. I don't make over $250,000, so I'm not worried.
redwhite&blue @ 50:
Intelligent debate, you say. All you did was parrot a ridiculous talking point; "Democrats will raise taxes!" Upon whom will taxes be raised?
You want an intelligent debate? Then back up your claim than McCain's plan "whatever it is" will be better than Obama's plan "whatever it is". Squawking out air-headed rhetoric doesn't go very far to show that you can actually "come together in a bi-partisian[sic] way".
James @ 59:
An interesting post. I'll have to look into that one.
theWalrus @ 11:
frankly, the colleges are full of the economists who rely on the trustees for their jobs and tenure. guess who's going to tow the party line?
James @ 58:
sometimes they may take a minute to show.
When John McCain and reality square off, reality wins. Every time.
I hate to break it to you, but reality isn't being covered by the MSM. Just watch the Sunday news shows. There's Carla, repeating the falseness.
And no one corrects her.
We need to face it, folks. Obama and McSame are TIED in the polls. The message on the truthiness of this and many other McSame talking points ARE NOT getting out.
I don't know what the answer is, but we're going to lose this, folks, if we don't get over the belief that just because the Right is wrong, people will see through it THIS time.
redwhite&blue @ 50:
hhmmm.... concern troll alert!!!!!!!
CoIntelPro for Pronktastic Victory Over SCLM, DIEBOLD, ESS and SEQUOIA! @ 64:
Actually, I think it was because I posted a link without using the link function. I guess its a safeguard on this site?
BuffyFan @ 65:
remember that the same people that give you the notNews also give you the polls. Whenever they wish,
they can control the sample group to get the results they want and
they can also frame the question to skew the results or
they can create false equivalencies, which is a favorite.
redwhite&blue @ 50:
your sarcastic (and insulting) 'concern' is duly noted.
CoIntelPro for Pronktastic Victory Over SCLM, DIEBOLD, ESS and SEQUOIA! @ 68:
frank luntz is currently polling a sample of 1000 americans on whether or not bush is a great president, or the greatest president*
(*comment property of the colbert report)
Mocking people is not a constructive use of your time to see your views turned into action... From either party, mind you.
“I’m saying that there is five Nobel laureates and 300 economists who think my economic plan is a good one.”
Where the hell did this idiot learn to speak English anyway?