maybe we can get John Bolton to help bring peace to the region. look at the bang up job he did with the UN. seriously America has to show leadership, but that boat sailed away long ago!!!

I would just like to point out that with war raging between Russia and Georgia, not to mention in Afghanistan, President Dinkledork is a spectator at the Olympic sporting events, i.e., a leisure activity. Typical.

All indications are that Georgia started it.

Shortly after 1000 US Special Forces finished "training" their military.

For a moment I thought maybe this was the Russian's promised response to the US proposal to put missiles in Poland and radar in the Czech Republic, but I guess not.

Note also that Georgia has the 3rd largest contingent in Iraq (after the US & UK) and has requested the US facilitate a rapid withdrawal of those 2-3000 men to return to Georgia.

If the US complies then the US escalates its involvement.

If the US doesn't comply .. what kind of "friends" are "we" ??

Aghanistan, Iraq .. and now Georgia.

Heckuva job George.

Wave your little flag at the Olympics ..

CNN is based in Atlanta so they are better able to cover the incursion.

The South shall rise again!

Note also that Georgia has the 3rd largest contingent in Iraq (after the US & UK) and has requested the US facilitate a rapid withdrawal of those 2-3000 men to return to Georgia.

Bush and McCain's response: "We don't to timetables. That'll be dictated by conditions on the ground"

L.A. Confidential @ 3:

The Georgian president declared that his country was “looking with hope” to the US. The armed confrontation with Russia, he claimed, “is not about Georgia anymore. It’s about America, its values... America stands up for those freedom-loving nations and supports them. That’s what America is all about.”

US imperialism’s main interest in Georgia is as an American bridgehead into the oil and gas-rich Caspian Basin and as a strategic transit route for funneling energy supplies out of the region, while bypassing Russia. To cement its ties with the Georgian regime, Washington has provided hundreds millions of dollars in military aid, while sending in large numbers of US military trainers for the country’s growing armed forces.

Yes-behind all Bush's high sounding rhetoric about Georgia's sovereignty lies another oil rich nation ripe for the fuc..er.."plucking".

The MSM would rather discuss Brett Favre.

pinkobait @ 12:

L.A. Confidential @ 3:

The Georgian president declared that his country was “looking with hope” to the US. The armed confrontation with Russia, he claimed, “is not about Georgia anymore. It’s about America, its values... America stands up for those freedom-loving nations and supports them. That’s what America is all about.”

US imperialism’s main interest in Georgia is as an American bridgehead into the oil and gas-rich Caspian Basin and as a strategic transit route for funneling energy supplies out of the region, while bypassing Russia. To cement its ties with the Georgian regime, Washington has provided hundreds millions of dollars in military aid, while sending in large numbers of US military trainers for the country’s growing armed forces.

Yes-behind all Bush's high sounding rhetoric about Georgia's sovereignty lies another oil rich nation ripe for the fuc..er.."plucking".

This is the stage the global market economy has come to. To support the interests of a few people, many are going to die.

Zenrage @ 13:

Am I the only one who thinks its funny that right below an article regarding a war between Russia and Georgia (I only wish it were the one in the US) is an ad for a Russian dating service?

I wonder how many of them are now newly single?

Ironic,

but Russia do have a surplus of women compared to men, if I recall correctly.

Jay Severin Has A Small Pen1s @ 8:

CNN is based in Atlanta so they are better able to cover the incursion.

The South shall rise again!

LOL .
I wonder how many 'merkins woke up this morning and thought the Reds had attacked Atlanta ?

This stinks to high heaven. You wondered why the Anthrax suspect payout coincided with the anthrax suspect suicide and just exactly how that happened in broad daylight?
Georgia has been in the news for the last 2 months. Who officially "declared war"' and when? This stinks.This stinks.This stinks.This stinks.This stinks.

This was my post from yesterday on this subject, but it fits right in with this evening.

How george and dick destroyed America

So here we are, exactly in the place many of us thought we might get to. we are still engaged in a War of Choice against a country that was not a threat to us. We’ve Spent almost a Trillion US Dollars on that shit-hole of a war. We’re just about bankrupt and borrowing heavily from the Chinese. We didn’t do anything about Darfur (no oil there).

Now we have Georgia ( a heavily Western leaning Nation who favors the US being attacked and we really are impotent at this point in time.

This is the “bush legacy” (lower case intended), he has done with the USA what he did with all of his companies and his baseball team, ran them into ruin.

But even in the face of all this ruin Americans still seem to have a huge “Moron Factor” in that they seem to be leaning toward McCain who beats the same old drum that bush and cheney have over the last 7.6 years.

If America elects McCain, then they will deserve what they get, they will be on the road that bush has already started toward being a second rate world power. A kind of derelict with her own infrastructure crumbling. We used to be the leader of the free world in Science and Technology, now we are sliding backward on that also.

So … Sorry Georgian people, all we can do is send someone over to pay lip service at this time.

Thanks george and dick, may you both die slow painful deaths

All hell breaks loose between Russia and Georgia

Well fiddle dee-dee

"The South shall rise again!" (Bill Clinton).

Tommorrow is another day.

Frankly my dear, I don't give a f**k (proposed remake of the movie.)

I always thought the name Tara was interesting for Scarlet O'Hara's manse. It was the name of the court King Conchobar and his Red Hand warriors of Ulster lived. Consider Mizzz Scarlett's patronym methinks it no coinkydink. Unfortunately it brings the Grand Myth of Ireland, the Sorrows of Deidre, the rise and glory of the greatest hero of all Cuchulain, and his ultimate death at the battle of Emain Macha, in conjunction with America's greatest faux-pas...

Until boosh.

21 L.A. Confidential

Wasn't Alucard the name Lon Chaney Jr used as the Son of Dracula? Read the name backwards. I always wished movies would use the pseudonym Dracula himself assumed to sign some real estate papers, and transact other business under while in England, Count De Ville.

U.S.-Georgia training begins amid Russia strain
Officials: Exercises unrelated to friction between Moscow, ex-Soviet state

This article is from mid July
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25684774/

ysbaddaden @ 26:

All hell breaks loose between Russia and Georgia

Well fiddle dee-dee

"The South shall rise again!" (Bill Clinton).

Tommorrow is another day.

Frankly my dear, I don't give a f**k (proposed remake of the movie.)

I always thought the name Tara was interesting for Scarlet O'Hara's manse. It was the name of the court King Conchobar and his Red Hand warriors of Ulster lived. Consider Mizzz Scarlett's patronym methinks it no coinkydink. Unfortunately it brings the Grand Myth of Ireland, the Sorrows of Deidre, the rise and glory of the greatest hero of all Cuchulain, and his ultimate death at the battle of Emain Macha, in conjunction with America's greatest faux-pas...

Until boosh.

He was killed? I thought that he was just de-TAINED!

Saw Richard Holbrooke on 'Charlie Rose' last night. He was saying that Putin hated the Georgian president and really badly wanted a war with Georgia. Holbrooke also said that Putin wanted to start off on the right foot with the next U.S. president, so the window between now and January is all the time he has to get his little war on in the Caucasus. The Russian take on things is that Bush is an incompetent lame-duck counting down the days till January 20th and that he will not interfere in Georgia.

I'm sure that America will stand on the side of liberty and freedom...or do we not get involved in the internal affairs of other nations?

I wonder how many Americans saw this on the news and thought it was the state at war, as they've probably never heard of the country.

see everytime King Dipshit goes on Vacation- EVERY August Something happens..and yes, I had been waiting for yet another crisis to arise so we could see McCramps Geographical Prowess....and yup..so last night instead of covering THIS in depth on the news- nope they are showing the King sitting in the stands bored and yawning.....oh- but he was there not as PREZ but as "a sports fan".....( and yes No.33 above me got it right- Russia/Putey just views him as an incompetent lame duck...)

31 Mick Piobr

Yep, once Cuchulain realized he was dying, he called some of his fighting comrades over to tie him to a post, while he held his spilling guts in with his hands, so that way he could die on his feet. As the son of the war god Lugh Lamhfada and a virgin princess, he was under the geasa to die neither lying on the ground nor in the air. His other two geasas was never to eat the flesh of his namesake, any kind of dog (Cuch was the name of the man who's dogs he killed when he was still five year old Setanta, and llain means dog), the other geasa was never to refuse a meal. But on his way to battle one of the Bean Sidhe disguised herself as an old woman cooking a dog, and invited him to eat. His only choice was to eat dog or refuse a meal, so he ate, knowing this meant it would be his last battle.

The image of Cuchulain lashed to a post with arrows riddling his body became the basis for the legends of St. Sebastian.

Apparent the Bushies think this will stop the Russians from responding to the US naval blockade of Iran (an act of war), and that's why they put their puppet in motion. Russia has a million man army though, and I'm pretty sure they can handle more than one confrontation at once. I trust Russia and Putin a hell of a lot more than I do Bush and his supporters here in the US.

"Russia Today" is Russian internet news TV in English.

The following URL can be opened in Windows Media Player under File -> Open Url ...

http://streaming.visionip.tv/Russia_Today

Naturally, the station takes the Russian point of view.

ysbaddaden @ 41:

31 Mick Piobr

Yep, once Cuchulain realized he was dying, he called some of his fighting comrades over to tie him to a post, while he held his spilling guts in with his hands, so that way he could die on his feet. As the son of the war god Lugh Lamhfada and a virgin princess, he was under the geasa to die neither lying on the ground nor in the air. His other two geasas was never to eat the flesh of his namesake, any kind of dog (Cuch was the name of the man who's dogs he killed when he was still five year old Setanta, and llain means dog), the other geasa was never to refuse a meal. But on his way to battle one of the Bean Sidhe disguised herself as an old woman cooking a dog, and invited him to eat. His only choice was to eat dog or refuse a meal, so he ate, knowing this meant it would be his last battle.

The image of Cuchulain lashed to a post with arrows riddling his body became the basis for the legends of St. Sebastian.

De TAINED? Oh, never mind; I wasn't trying to Bor U

NoBuddy @ 45:

"Russia Today" is Russian internet news TV in English.

The following URL can be opened in Windows Media Player under File -> Open Url ...

http://streaming.visionip.tv/Russia_Today

Naturally, the station takes the Russian point of view.

Yeah, like the terms he used "Russian Peace-keepers" Kinda sounded like GWB trying to justify his screw-ups.

Jay Severin Has A Small Pen1s @ 8:

CNN is based in Atlanta so they are better able to cover the incursion.

The South shall rise again!

LoL..

Nice with both posts

Don Rumsfeld hater @ 52:

Russia wouldn't have attacked Georgia if Hussein Obama and his running mate Paris Hilton were in Washington D.C .doing their damn jobs instead of campaigning all over the world. You see - we can't have celebrities as Pres. and V.P.. McCain is the only sane choice Nov. 5th. Isn't it obvious by now?

(sick humor. I'm a progressive librul .........who watched that hot new Paris Hilton political campaign video more than 100 times since she made it a few days ago. I just love her !!!! Oh God !! Hot looks ...AND brains ...AND an energy plan.)

use protection, she has Clamidia ...

Wait, this just in:

"Republican presidential candidate, John McCain, was asked about his thoughts
concerinng the recent incursion in Georgia. Mr. McCain said, "I believe in the
soverignty of the United States, and therefore, in the soverignty of Georgia.
This cannot, and my friends I say to you, it Will Not Stand."

L.A. Confidential @ 7:

right on! @ 1:

WTF?!

This has been going on since yesterday. Georgia decided to militarily seize control of the Pro Russia enclave of South Ossetia and Russia responded.

Yeah I was following this yesterday, but nobody had declared war then...

Meanwhile, old wrinkly white haired guy has a lobbyist on his campaign with big ties to the Georgian government and only recently old wrinkly dude contradicted his own campaign again to tell George Snuffleopagus that he still wanted Russia kicked out of the G8. He is all alone on this one and is backing Georgia in the fight. Guess it's that old maverick streak coming out again, eh?

woody, tokin librul @ 58:

It's about OIL, friends.

There's one BEEEG mother of a pipeline that disgorges oil from all over the trans-Caspian into tankers at the Black Sea port of Sukhumi, in the disputed country of Abkhazia. THe other major Georgian oil port is also in disputed territory, in the south. Tankers carry the oil from Georgia to Bulgaria, thence through KOSOVO (ring any bells?), directly under Camp Bondsteel, on ots way to refineries in Romania, etc.

The west needs to retain independence/autonomy for Georgia to forestall the transfer af all those oil shipments through Russia, which already has pretty much of a stranglehold on energy for western Europe. Thus we have the current conflict...

Follow the OIL...

Plus Putin is not going to allow Cheney and the Oil and Energy Cons to set up missle bases aimed at Russia next door.

He said. . . "we are not going to allow a few evil Americans to have that kind of clout in the area".

47 Mick Piobr Says: ysbaddaden @ 41:

31 Mick Piobr

Yep, once Cuchulain realized he was dying, he called some of his fighting comrades over to tie him to a post, while he held his spilling guts in with his hands, so that way he could die on his feet. As the son of the war god Lugh Lamhfada and a virgin princess, he was under the geasa to die neither lying on the ground nor in the air. His other two geasas was never to eat the flesh of his namesake, any kind of dog (Cuch was the name of the man who’s dogs he killed when he was still five year old Setanta, and llain means dog), the other geasa was never to refuse a meal. But on his way to battle one of the Bean Sidhe disguised herself as an old woman cooking a dog, and invited him to eat. His only choice was to eat dog or refuse a meal, so he ate, knowing this meant it would be his last battle.

The image of Cuchulain lashed to a post with arrows riddling his body became the basis for the legends of St. Sebastian.

De TAINED? Oh, never mind; I wasn’t trying to Bor U

But I was.

When I heard the news yesterday, I immediately envisioned in my minds eyes several hundred rednecks, armed with shotguns, showing up at city hall in Atlanta because they heard (read in full accent) "the Russian's had invaded Ghor-gah". :)

General_Rennenkampf @ 63:

Russia's been asking for this for damn near 15 years. It forced this province to break away from a sovereign nation, as a protectorate (with the "best interest of the people in mind," of course), and has repeatedly ignored the request of Georgia for dialogue on this issue. Matter of fact, by pumping up secessionists in Abkhazia and due to its sheer size predominance plus being Georgia's neighbor, Russia should not be the least damn bit surprised the Georgian President started doing this. This has nothing to do with Bush's Administration, and everything to do with Russia wanting to pretend 1991 didn't happen, and keep up organizing this colonial empire, constantly browbeating smaller nations (that unlike the US, which is a continent and an ocean away from Iraq, even though it's the same pricnciple it's right next door to it.), and then that smaller nation tries surprise and it fails, miserably.

Russia's bitten the wrong apple. No sympathy from me for the former KGB Colonel and his misadventure he spawned.

What a bunch of bollocsk. It was the Georgia who started this. Georgia is the agressor and Russia is just responding they have to defend their allies and their citizens. Georgia broked the status quo which lasted since 1992 - South Osetia and its people never wanted to be part of Georgia. And in fact South Osetia was de-facto independent republic right from the collapse of Soviet Union (although not internationaly recognize) they have their own governmant, schools, police etc. Russia did not forced this province to break away - the fact is that Ossetians always wanted to be part of Russia - Ossetians are ethnically distinct people with their own indo-european language and of iranian descent. They live in that region since 13th century. Currently there is (in South Osetia) about 60 000 of people - 45 000 are Ossetian (of which 70% have russian citizenship) and only about 15 000 Georgians.

The same goes for Abkhazia - Abkhazians (which are one of the original tribe of georgians from Cacausus, releated to Cartli) never wanted to be part of the Georgia and they started their fight for independence right from the creation of Georgian republic.

DudefromPrague @ 68:

General_Rennenkampf @ 63:

Russia's been asking for this for damn near 15 years. It forced this province to break away from a sovereign nation, as a protectorate (with the "best interest of the people in mind," of course), and has repeatedly ignored the request of Georgia for dialogue on this issue. Matter of fact, by pumping up secessionists in Abkhazia and due to its sheer size predominance plus being Georgia's neighbor, Russia should not be the least damn bit surprised the Georgian President started doing this. This has nothing to do with Bush's Administration, and everything to do with Russia wanting to pretend 1991 didn't happen, and keep up organizing this colonial empire, constantly browbeating smaller nations (that unlike the US, which is a continent and an ocean away from Iraq, even though it's the same pricnciple it's right next door to it.), and then that smaller nation tries surprise and it fails, miserably.

Russia's bitten the wrong apple. No sympathy from me for the former KGB Colonel and his misadventure he spawned.

What a bunch of bollocsk. It was the Georgia who started this. Georgia is the agressor and Russia is just responding they have to defend their allies and their citizens. Georgia broked the status quo which lasted since 1992 - South Osetia and its people never wanted to be part of Georgia. And in fact South Osetia was de-facto independent republic right from the collapse of Soviet Union (although not internationaly recognize) they have their own governmant, schools, police etc. Russia did not forced this province to break away - the fact is that Ossetians always wanted to be part of Russia - Ossetians are ethnically distinct people with their own indo-european language and of iranian descent. They live in that region since 13th century. Currently there is (in South Osetia) about 60 000 of people - 45 000 are Ossetian (of which 70% have russian citizenship) and only about 15 000 Georgians.

The same goes for Abkhazia - Abkhazians (which are one of the original tribe of georgians from Cacausus, releated to Cartli) never wanted to be part of the Georgia and they started their fight for independence right from the creation of Georgian republic.

The Abkhazia of today is a creation of the Soviet empire designed to break the harmony of Caucasian peoples. I thought imperialism was bad? You mean the Russian bear can do it but Uncle Sam can't? The only difference between this and Iraq is that Russia's next door, and we're an ocean and a continent or two away. Why does Russia get away with what is naked provocation?

Russia is acting like 1991 never happened. Georgia has as much a right to Ossetia as the United States does to California and Nevada, unless you want to hand those places back to Klamath and Shoshone and the California peoples, too. If every nationality gets its own ethnic state, why then let's break up Germany, Italy, the UK, the United States, Mexico, Russia, China, Japan...hell, fuck that, let's just go back to pre-Sumerian times!

Sorry, this displays an unrealistic sense of Russian and Ossetian victimhood and ignoring the Russian provocations.

L.A. Confidential @ 27:

dada @ 15:

They have separatists in Georgia that want to break away to Russia and that is what is causing the upheaval.

Thats like Mexico attacking L.A. "They have separatists in L.A. that want to break away from the U.S. so they attempted a military takeover."

Yeah, the separatists on Native American reservations want their country back too.

L.A. Confidential @ 27:

dada @ 15:

They have separatists in Georgia that want to break away to Russia and that is what is causing the upheaval.

Thats like Mexico attacking L.A. "They have separatists in L.A. that want to break away from the U.S. so they attempted a military takeover."

Yeah, and we should give the Indians back their land, too. Wanna go back to Europe? I'm sure they'd just love 200 million Yankeestanis moving in...

ysbaddaden @ 75:

69 Bob Morris

Funny thing about Azerbiajan, Bubba Clinton put them on a do not deal with list because their leader Aliyev committed genocide against the Korob-Nagorno. Literally within a couple days of booshco seizing the White House with the aid of conservative activist Supreme Court coup consipirators, chainey took Azerbiajan off the list so we could have access to the Caspian sea oil.

Is everybody watching the Olympics? It seems rather quiet on this site today.

Abkhazia engaged in a little human renewal as well, Georgians used to be much more common there than they are now, and it's for the same reason that the Indians in California disappeared that their numbers decreased.

Zenrage @ 13:

Am I the only one who thinks its funny that right below an article regarding a war between Russia and Georgia (I only wish it were the one in the US) is an ad for a Russian dating service?

I wonder how many of them are now newly single?

[That's how internet ads work. Their bots find key words on the page and match ads with them. Sometimes it's spot on, sometimes it's ironic, sometimes it's totally inappropriate-Sitemonitor]

I was researching Auschwitz at the time of GW & Laura's visit there. (GW's granddad Prescott owned shares in the Labor & Death Camps and Coal Mining Operation there.)

One online image was an old photo of the electric fences.

At the side of the page was (you guessed it) an advertisement for electric fences.

Charles @ 77:

I just watched this soldier (don't know if it was a Georgian or Russian soldier) try to kill this other man and his two dogs who were just trying to run across the road about 100 yards away near a bombed out building. And some people trying to help this woman who was obviously injured, but somehow (it looked impossible) survived her building being bombed to ruble. How pathetic is that? Just kill anything that moves. Humans are insane. It's so easy to get us to murder any and all life forms for no good reason. Hopefully we will kill ourselves off some day. The scourge known as the human race cannot be allowed to leave this planet.

Wanna know what ants do when rival ant colonies meet? One ant colony lives, the other goes extinct. Ants make both chimps and humans seem rank amateurs at warfare. Every ant battle is a Stalingrad or a Teutoberg Forest. Not so much for every human battle, even in today's age.

General_Rennenkampf @ 70:

DudefromPrague @ 68:

General_Rennenkampf @ 63:

Russia's been asking for this for damn near 15 years. It forced this province to break away from a sovereign nation, as a protectorate (with the "best interest of the people in mind," of course), and has repeatedly ignored the request of Georgia for dialogue on this issue. Matter of fact, by pumping up secessionists in Abkhazia and due to its sheer size predominance plus being Georgia's neighbor, Russia should not be the least damn bit surprised the Georgian President started doing this. This has nothing to do with Bush's Administration, and everything to do with Russia wanting to pretend 1991 didn't happen, and keep up organizing this colonial empire, constantly browbeating smaller nations (that unlike the US, which is a continent and an ocean away from Iraq, even though it's the same pricnciple it's right next door to it.), and then that smaller nation tries surprise and it fails, miserably.

Russia's bitten the wrong apple. No sympathy from me for the former KGB Colonel and his misadventure he spawned.

What a bunch of bollocsk. It was the Georgia who started this. Georgia is the agressor and Russia is just responding they have to defend their allies and their citizens. Georgia broked the status quo which lasted since 1992 - South Osetia and its people never wanted to be part of Georgia. And in fact South Osetia was de-facto independent republic right from the collapse of Soviet Union (although not internationaly recognize) they have their own governmant, schools, police etc. Russia did not forced this province to break away - the fact is that Ossetians always wanted to be part of Russia - Ossetians are ethnically distinct people with their own indo-european language and of iranian descent. They live in that region since 13th century. Currently there is (in South Osetia) about 60 000 of people - 45 000 are Ossetian (of which 70% have russian citizenship) and only about 15 000 Georgians.

The same goes for Abkhazia - Abkhazians (which are one of the original tribe of georgians from Cacausus, releated to Cartli) never wanted to be part of the Georgia and they started their fight for independence right from the creation of Georgian republic.

The Abkhazia of today is a creation of the Soviet empire designed to break the harmony of Caucasian peoples. I thought imperialism was bad? You mean the Russian bear can do it but Uncle Sam can't? The only difference between this and Iraq is that Russia's next door, and we're an ocean and a continent or two away. Why does Russia get away with what is naked provocation?

Russia is acting like 1991 never happened. Georgia has as much a right to Ossetia as the United States does to California and Nevada, unless you want to hand those places back to Klamath and Shoshone and the California peoples, too. If every nationality gets its own ethnic state, why then let's break up Germany, Italy, the UK, the United States, Mexico, Russia, China, Japan...hell, fuck that, let's just go back to pre-Sumerian times!

Sorry, this displays an unrealistic sense of Russian and Ossetian victimhood and ignoring the Russian provocations.

Abkhazia of today is not creation of the Soviet empire, (if you would say that about Georgia you would be more correct) majority of population in Abkhazia are Abkhaz (more than 100 000 people) and those people lived there for many centuries. Are you kidding with harmony of Caucasian peoples? And blaming Russia for it? There never was harmony there were many ethnically and culturaly distinct people who live at peace and war at various times but they were not united - there was many conflicts.

You are wrong as you claim that only difference between thin and Iraq is that Russia is next door - other major difference is that people of South Osetia wants to be part of Russia and wanted Russian assistance against the Georgian agressor - on the other hand Iraqis opposed and still are opposing american presence in Iraq .

Furthermore: about what Russian provocation are you talking about? It was the Georgians who invaded South Osetia and wanted to occupy it. (South Ossetians had two referendums and in both they have voted in favour of the idea to split from Georgia and to join Russia and their brothers in Northern Ossetia).

What kind of double standart is this (not only from the "west" but also from the Russians)? West was for independent Kosovo and Montenegro while Russia was against it. West is against independent Abkhazia and South Osetia. And bot Russia and west are against independent Chechnya.

I for one am all for state separations if that is what the people in those countries/regions wants and if the reason for it is not purely economical. I supported independent Montenegro, Kosovo and I support South Osetia and Abkhazia in their struggle to join Russia. I also support Chechnyan independence from Russia.

In this case Russia is doing what is right!

General_Rennenkampf @ 83:

{ OK, Use the Block Quote. Both of you.Bandwidth is expensive. SiteMonitor}

Sorry, Sitemonitor, I forgot. Please forgive.
{ I'm sorry I had to do that General. But it was getting too long. I appreciate your input here. You've always got something intelligent to add. SiteMonitor}

General_Rennenkampf @ 85:

Furthermore: about what Russian provocation are you talking about? It was the Georgians who invaded South Osetia and wanted to occupy it. (South Ossetians had two referendums and in both they have voted in favour of the idea to split from Georgia and to join Russia and their brothers in Northern Ossetia).

What kind of double standart is this (not only from the "west" but also from the Russians)? West was for independent Kosovo and Montenegro while Russia was against it. West is against independent Abkhazia and South Osetia. And bot Russia and west are against independent Chechnya.

I for one am all for state separations if that is what the people in those countries/regions wants and if the reason for it is not purely economical. I supported independent Montenegro, Kosovo and I support South Osetia and Abkhazia in their struggle to join Russia. I also support Chechnyan independence from Russia.

In this case Russia is doing what is right!

@DudefromPrague: Georgia's the aggressor, but quit pretending Russia's blameless. If I went over and hit my friend, and then sat there saying "Come get me, I'd be right in beating the shit out of him. That's Russia's behavior here in one sentence.

@Jerry: The US created its empire by 1890. We've kept it since then. The USSR was born and died in the 20th Century. We've reached 118 years of hegemony over most of North America. You lose at history.

{ Edited, SiteMonitor}

Sorry, again.

I guess Russia thinks if bush can invade a country on a whim SO CAN THEY.....that's what the Iraq invasion has instilled in the peoples of the world.

Zenrage @ 13:

Am I the only one who thinks its funny that right below an article regarding a war between Russia and Georgia (I only wish it were the one in the US) is an ad for a Russian dating service?

I wonder how many of them are now newly single?

[That's how internet ads work. Their bots find key words on the page and match ads with them. Sometimes it's spot on, sometimes it's ironic, sometimes it's totally inappropriate-Sitemonitor]

I never said I didn't click the link... I just thought it was funny.

General_Rennenkampf @ 65:

Mithridates @ 5:

Not only that but Azerbaijan is taking a very close look at the situation, because they have pretty much the same thing with Armenia. The two nations have been meeting for some time to try to come to a solution but with their economic growth at over 30% every year for the past few years (no, I didn't miss a decimal point, they have the highest economic growth in the world right now) thanks to their oil resources, they've been building up their army quite a bit and are also looking pretty confident. At the same time though the BTC Pipeline runs through Georgia and there were rumours that it was bombed (or another pipeline that goes through Georgia from Azerbaijan, don't know which one) and they definitely aren't happy with that.

Interesting fact: the Ossetians (the people living in the centre of the conflict) speak an Iranian language. They're technically pro-Russian but linguistically they're pretty isolated in that region.

No, they are not isolated...there's at least two Iranian languages spoken in neighboring Azerbaijan and Iran's not that far away itself. Azeris will have a deep interest in this, as will Armenia. Neither, I think, wants a Russian reconquest.

Do you mean Talysh and Kurdish? I know Iran's pretty close by geographically but you still have to get through a number of other languages to get to another Iranian one and I think these events have shown that a km of distance to the people in the Caucasus is not the same as in other countries (more along the lines of a km of distance in Israel and Palestine).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Caucasus-ethnic_en.svg

But I guess it depends on what you define isolated to be.

Just wait and see. America is going to walk out from Georgia just the way it did with Afghanistan in the 1980's.
Why? Because the Russians are not the Iraqis. Bush knows that.

Involved @ 93:

With all the racist and gang shooting happening in America, what gives us the nerves to talk about gangs in another country? (Take note Dudgeformprague)

I took the note and I would like to inform you that I am czech. (BTW in Czech Republic we also have big problem with racism) but that doesn't ban me from critisizing racism in other countries. In Russia the racism is really rampant they have many neo-nazi gangs who are killing immigrant and ethnic minorities. These gangs are really sick, the situation is pretty bad to the point that these sickos are filming their killings and even compete in it (like as who can kill more). Its really horrendous.

Mithridates @ 92:

General_Rennenkampf @ 65:

Mithridates @ 5:

Not only that but Azerbaijan is taking a very close look at the situation, because they have pretty much the same thing with Armenia. The two nations have been meeting for some time to try to come to a solution but with their economic growth at over 30% every year for the past few years (no, I didn't miss a decimal point, they have the highest economic growth in the world right now) thanks to their oil resources, they've been building up their army quite a bit and are also looking pretty confident. At the same time though the BTC Pipeline runs through Georgia and there were rumours that it was bombed (or another pipeline that goes through Georgia from Azerbaijan, don't know which one) and they definitely aren't happy with that.

Interesting fact: the Ossetians (the people living in the centre of the conflict) speak an Iranian language. They're technically pro-Russian but linguistically they're pretty isolated in that region.

No, they are not isolated...there's at least two Iranian languages spoken in neighboring Azerbaijan and Iran's not that far away itself. Azeris will have a deep interest in this, as will Armenia. Neither, I think, wants a Russian reconquest.

Do you mean Talysh and Kurdish? I know Iran's pretty close by geographically but you still have to get through a number of other languages to get to another Iranian one and I think these events have shown that a km of distance to the people in the Caucasus is not the same as in other countries (more along the lines of a km of distance in Israel and Palestine).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Caucasus-ethnic_en.svg

But I guess it depends on what you define isolated to be.

Like Andamanese, no related languages worldwide. Therefore, to me, isolates in language are Japanese, several Indian languages in the American continent, and things like that. As Ossetian's got other languages in its family, it's not an isolate.

DudefromPrague @ 87:

I am not saying that Russia is blameless - but in this current crisis Russia is not to be blamed. It was not their mistake, they had to react on the invasion of South Osetia by Georgia. I have my fair share of objections against Russia - From the war crimes they have commited in Chechnya through their corruption ridden politicians to the way they are not able to deal with many of Russian gangs of racist killer groups.

But nevertheless in this case they are on the good side. There is no other way this could be solved other then let the Ossetians do what they want and that is to join Russia.

Or...Russia could have simply left Georgia alone to begin with. But that's too much to ask of Russia.

L.A. Confidential @ 3:

The Georgian president declared that his country was “looking with hope” to the US. The armed confrontation with Russia, he claimed, “is not about Georgia anymore. It’s about America, its values... America stands up for those freedom-loving nations and supports them. That’s what America is all about.”

US imperialism’s main interest in Georgia is as an American bridgehead into the oil and gas-rich Caspian Basin and as a strategic transit route for funneling energy supplies out of the region, while bypassing Russia. To cement its ties with the Georgian regime, Washington has provided hundreds millions of dollars in military aid, while sending in large numbers of US military trainers for the country’s growing armed forces.

Right on...it's all about the oil.

...or coRussia could be paying Georgia back for Stalin...

Nah.

It's oil.

Mithridates @ 92:

General_Rennenkampf @ 65:

Mithridates @ 5:

No, they are not isolated...there's at least two Iranian languages spoken in neighboring Azerbaijan and Iran's not that far away itself. Azeris will have a deep interest in this, as will Armenia. Neither, I think, wants a Russian reconquest.

Do you mean Talysh and Kurdish? I know Iran's pretty close by geographically but you still have to get through a number of other languages to get to another Iranian one and I think these events have shown that a km of distance to the people in the Caucasus is not the same as in other countries (more along the lines of a km of distance in Israel and Palestine).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Caucasus-ethnic_en.svg

But I guess it depends on what you define isolated to be.

I consider the word "isolated" in linguistics to refer to its proper definition, no linguistic relations anywhere else in the world. Languages like Jarawa, Zuni, Japanese, those are "isolated," languages. Languages that have language families...are not.

Ah. I wasn't thinking of the linguistic term, but rather 'no friends next door' type isolation. Isolated, not a linguistic isolate.

DudefromPrague @ 89:

Sorry Marge but this was a lame comparsion.

This is not Russian invasion. This is a reaction to an invasion.
Georgia has invaded South Osetia and as a reaction Russia has sent its army to aid their allies Ossetians. Russians have no intention to occupy Georgia they only want to make sure that Georgia will not occupy Osetia.

Erm, you seem to be missing something here, Russia has been occupying South Ossetia, in the form of Russian "Peacekeepers" if you pay attention to the early statements of the Russian government that's the main justification for Russian action, that Russian soldiers within South Ossetia have been killed. They had troops in South Ossetia before this, and they will after.

joeedugan @ 34:

Saw Richard Holbrooke on 'Charlie Rose' last night. He was saying that Putin hated the Georgian president and really badly wanted a war with Georgia. Holbrooke also said that Putin wanted to start off on the right foot with the next U.S. president, so the window between now and January is all the time he has to get his little war on in the Caucasus. The Russian take on things is that Bush is an incompetent lame-duck counting down the days till January 20th and that he will not interfere in Georgia.

I dont trust Holbrooke, he is a neocon, in on the fix

Anyone else notice that during that last Israel/Lebanon dustup there were people saying Israel used disproportionate violence and the right laughed and derided such a notion. Those same words are coming from the White House now.

They want to keep us stupid. They forgot there is the Internet, and some of us unlike JM, know how to use it.

Jerzy @ 23:

I don't mean to pick knits but Georgia is NOT EASTERN EUROPE. Georgia is in the Caucasus Mountain region and borders, among others, Azerbaijan, Armenia, and Turkey, and is East of the Black Sea. Technically it is in a Trans-Continental Region. As a Pole and a member of the Western frontier of Eastern Europe I feel it does me and the rest of my Eastern Europeans a disservice to off-handedly throw out the old meme of Eastern Europe being a ridiculously crazy place full of strife.

I'm a Democrat and a liberal, not just because I feel we have the moral high ground and ideals closer to mine, because I find that anyone who knows more than the basics about Geography and History is usually a Democrat and a liberal. Just check out Al Franken drawing the entire US from memory, I'm sure he can probably tell you what part of the world Georgia is in.

So please, why not go to the Wiki first and read about the country you are covering. Maybe you'd make us all informed about it, sound less ignorant, sound less insulting without even knowing it, and sound less like watching Fox in the morning.

Thanks a bunch,
Your friendly blogging Polack

You are the only stupid Polack I know. Go to Wikipedia and see the eastern border of Europe: "To the east, Europe is generally divided from Asia by the water divide of the Ural Mountains, the Ural River, and by the Caspian Sea." Eastern border is not Black Sea, it is the Caspian Sea. Secondly, Turkey is not east of Black Sea; it is South of Black Sea (with a little bit of west of Black Sea). Thirdly, George is partially in Eastern Europe.

Tim @ 104:

DudefromPrague @ 89:

Sorry Marge but this was a lame comparsion.

This is not Russian invasion. This is a reaction to an invasion.
Georgia has invaded South Osetia and as a reaction Russia has sent its army to aid their allies Ossetians. Russians have no intention to occupy Georgia they only want to make sure that Georgia will not occupy Osetia.

Erm, you seem to be missing something here, Russia has been occupying South Ossetia, in the form of Russian "Peacekeepers" if you pay attention to the early statements of the Russian government that's the main justification for Russian action, that Russian soldiers within South Ossetia have been killed. They had troops in South Ossetia before this, and they will after.

Please educate yourself on this topic before you open your mouth next time. Russia has not been occupying Sout Ossetia - Those Russian Peackeepers (as well as Georgian Peackeepers) were in that region (around the borders of South Ossetia) since the 1992 when Ossetians succesfully broked away from Georgia (after a bloody civil war) (since 1992 the South Ossetia operates de-facto as a independent country - with its own shools, health care system, police, governmant etc. - eventhough they are not internationally recognised) Since that time that status quo is in the place and international community has agreed that in South Ossetia there will be Russian and Georgian Peackeeping forces in limited numbers. What happened prior to this crisis was that Georgians invaded South Ossetia, pushed Ossetians out of many of their villages and cities, killed Ossetian civilians as well as couple of those Russian Peackeepers. And to this Russia had to react so they have send their army to push Georgian army out of Sout Ossetia. Ossetians never wanted to be part of Georgia, throughout their history they (Ossetians) were always culturally, ethnically and politacally independent of Georgia. (Ossetians are living in that region since 13th century, they have their own distinct indo-european language and they are of iranian ancestry) What Ossetians wants (they had already two referendums on this and voted decisively in favour of it, in both cases) is to join Russia and function as an autonomous Ossetian region within a Russia with their brothers in Norther Ossetia who are already part of Russia.

Well the lower oil prices were nice while they lasted. Look for oil to be over 150 a barrel soon. Conflict and oil prices linked at the hip worse yet that's a oil zone I think.

People, have you no shame? There is outrageous lie and there is facts… Georgia attack independent from it for 17 years civilian region in midnight in the day of opening Olympics with missiles and battle-planes, attacked purposely peacekeapers in region, and already in the morning Saak….li giving interview to CNN… what could be more hypocrisy ??? Try to think independently, don’t be brainwashed vegetables… Western media haveforggoten what the truth mean…

Ossetia, Abhazia become independed states in early 1990's, just in time with Geogia, Ukraine, Russia, Kazahstan and other fomer Soviet Union repablics, the only difference is that world community do not "recognize" Abhazia and Ossetia. Ossetia become geogian territory just according to the wish of Saakashvili... US "recognize" wish of Saakashvili and form a new country... Just US democracy and nothing more...
Western press do not say about georgian fascism and genocide of ossetia and abhazia people, do not say about dozens thousands of civilians crossing Russia border seeking for life-saving. But CNN CRYING about Russian invasion to Georgia, accuse Russia in trying to defend ossetian people... Russia keep peace in the region fot 17 years from the first war Georgia with Ossetia and Abhazia and now in western press it became agressor - shameless hypocrisy. People, try to get truth for your making your opinions, do not read US and Britain press...
In Geogia there is no TV and Internet except selected sources for now, official sourse tell them that Ossetia attacks Geogia!!! There is tremendous desinformation in US, UK... it is the war of US propaganda mashine against Russia... US tries to make it WWIII, incite western people against russians... don't be blind... be carefull....

Pavel @ 118:

People, have you no shame? There is outrageous lie and there is facts… Georgia attack independent from it for 17 years civilian region in midnight in the day of opening Olympics with missiles and battle-planes, attacked purposely peacekeapers in region, and already in the morning Saak….li giving interview to CNN… what could be more hypocrisy ??? Try to think independently, don’t be brainwashed vegetables… Western media haveforggoten what the truth mean…

Ossetia, Abhazia become independed states in early 1990's, just in time with Geogia, Ukraine, Russia, Kazahstan and other fomer Soviet Union repablics, the only difference is that world community do not "recognize" Abhazia and Ossetia. Ossetia become geogian territory just according to the wish of Saakashvili... US "recognize" wish of Saakashvili and form a new country... Just US democracy and nothing more...
Western press do not say about georgian fascism and genocide of ossetia and abhazia people, do not say about dozens thousands of civilians crossing Russia border seeking for life-saving. But CNN CRYING about Russian invasion to Georgia, accuse Russia in trying to defend ossetian people... Russia keep peace in the region fot 17 years from the first war Georgia with Ossetia and Abhazia and now in western press it became agressor - shameless hypocrisy. People, try to get truth for your making your opinions, do not read US and Britain press...
In Geogia there is no TV and Internet except selected sources for now, official sourse tell them that Ossetia attacks Geogia!!! There is tremendous desinformation in US, UK... it is the war of US propaganda mashine against Russia... US tries to make it WWIII, incite western people against russians... don't be blind... be carefull....

Pavel, i think you are the only man who use his own mind to do the conclusions!
Other people prefer lazily to absorb the facts that are slipping to them...

You know interpreting the facts differently to you is not the same as lying.

And fine, we disagree, I think it's Russians playing the old imperial game and the Georgian leadership foolishly gambling with their citizens lives, and you think it's good vs bad, the good Russians vs the terrible Georgians, whatever.

The Georgians are fleeing and it looks like the Russians have won the fight.
Will Russia stop at the border or will them go full throttle and retake the whole country?

DudefromPrague @ 125:

No they will not retake the whole country. They only wants to make sure that Georgia will not take over South Ossetia. But I am not sure if they will stop at the borders immediately - In Russia there is some talk about how to deal with Saakhasvili for his aggression (Putin even blamed Saakhasvili for genocide) - Right now Russian authorities are gathering eye-wittness accounts (from some 30 000 South Ossetian refugees who fled to Russia for protection) about possible war crimes - For legal prosecution of Saakhasvili.

Why wouldn't they? They've done it before.

Russia's just getting warmed up to rebuild their empire. Perhaps Kazahkstan or Tajikstan or some other Central Asian territory will have a similiar incident in a couple of months....

The Russian Empire wasn't gonna die forever.

We occupy countries half-way around the world and have the nerve to condemn Russia's actions? The American ego never ceases to amaze me.

It's funny to notice that in the United States medias it's the russian who started the war while in other countries medias it's the Georgia. Funny to notice also that in Ossetia ther is oil and a pipeline... What a coincidence...

Didn't we see this movie once before? I think it was released in 1999. The role of South Ossetia played by Kosovo, Georgia by Serbia and Russia by the USA. The double standards in this world are amazing to witness.