McCain, Lieberman & Graham Throw Their Weight Behind Odierno
By Steve Hynd Sunday Dec 21, 2008 6:30am
The Deciderer, according to the Three Amigos
There's a lot of fluff about bi-partisan agreement, withdrawing to leave a democratic Iraq and the "successes" of the last two years in an op-ed by John McCain, Joe Lieberman and Lindsey Graham in the Washington Post today. But there's only one important bit.
Gen. Odierno was the operational architect of the surge in 2007, when he served as deputy to Gen. Petraeus, as well as of the tribal engagement strategy that persuaded Sunnis to abandon the insurgency and join our side. Gen. Odierno -- as the current commander on the ground -- is the person whose judgment should matter most in determining how fast and how deep a drawdown can be ordered responsibly.
This is the same General Odierno who recently forgot his place in the chain of command, saying that he had no intention of sticking to the U.S. agreement with Iraq which says all U.S. troops must be withdrawn from Iraqi cities by the summer. He also hinted that the 2011 final withdrawal date might be ignorable, saying "Three years is a very long time."
The Maliki government was quick to respond that it expected the letter of the status of forces agreement to be adhered to. But Bush administration loyalist Odierno, by indicating that the U.S. would continue to try to bend treaties and deals all out of shape instead of sticking to its word, has badly damaged Obama's political capital abroad before the President Elect has even taken office. It's off a piece with other military statements, as Gareth Porter reported on Thursday:
Gen. David Petraeus, now commander of CENTCOM, and Gen. Ray Odierno, the top U.S. commander in Iraq, who opposed Obama's 16-month withdrawal plan during the election campaign, have drawn up their own alternative withdrawal plan rejecting that timeline, as the New York Times reported Thursday. That plan was communicated to Obama in general terms by Secretary of Defence Robert M.Gates and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Mike Mullen when he met with his national security team in Chicago on Dec. 15, according to the Times.
The determination of the military leadership to ignore the U.S.-Iraq agreement and to pressure Obama on his withdrawal policy was clear from remarks made by Mullen in a news conference on Nov. 17 -- after U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker had signed the agreement in Baghdad.
Mullen declared that he considered it "important" that withdrawal of U.S. forces from Iraq "be conditions-based". That position directly contradicted the terms of the agreement, and Mullen was asked whether the agreement required all U.S. troops to leave Iraq by the end of 2011, regardless of the security conditions. He answered "Yes," but then added, "Three years is a long time. Conditions could change in that period of time..."
Mullen said U.S. officials would "continue to have discussions with them over time, as conditions continue to evolve", and said that reversing the outcome of the negotiations was "theoretically possible".
Obama's decision to keep Gates, who was known to be opposed to Obama's withdrawal timetable, as defence secretary confirmed the belief of the Pentagon leadership that Obama would not resist the military effort to push back against his Iraq withdrawal plan. A source close to the Obama transition team has told IPS that Obama had made the decision for a frankly political reason. Obama and his advisers believed the administration would be politically vulnerable on national security and viewed the Gates nomination as a way of blunting political criticism of its policies.
The "Three Amigos" advice is that Odierno, not Obama, should be Commander In Chief - "the person whose judgement should matter most" - when it comes to decisions about the US military presence in Iraq and that Odierno, not the Iraqi government, should be seen as the ruler of Iraq. They're throwing their weight behind the military's undermining of Obama and the Iraqi government's authority. The correct reply to their advice is "Hell, no."
Crossposted from Newshoggers
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Many senior officers were sufficiently insubordinate that, had I been CiC, I'd have had their stars. This
looks like more of the same, except that Mr.O credulously GAVE them what amounts to permission.
Follow orders or resign.
Military coup d'etat?
The 'surge' reimposed the iron-fisted rule over the Iraqi people that McCain, Lieberman & Graham condemned Saddam Hussein for.
That McCain, Lieberman and Graham won after all!
Vote, schmote.
Odierno seriously needs to be busted to buck private and put in the front lines to get an education! With Generals like him we're totally fucked!
...and he sends a chill through me every time I see his face.
If the Obama team acts upon the recommendations of those three stooges of politics, we are doomed.
I believe that Obama has one thing he can do and that is to invite the good general to Washington and fire his bald headed ass.
There is only one Commander-in-Chief and
"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it."
---George Santayana
If you or one of your Jewish allies is seriously considering a massive strike on the country next door to Iraq, why on earth would you pull out any armed forces?
Its a joke folk. They are trying to spin you with words and discussion that deflect the real topic:when do we bomb Iran?
so sick of people coming on here and saying that they love jews but hate israel
much better when you state clearly that you think that jews run our foreign policy
and what makes you any different than the nazis on stormfront
go fuck yourself
Dear Uncle Joe Mccarthy:
What is your honest opinion of this:
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20081215_...
I, for one, don't care to have my tax dollars used for this. Do you?
But apparently Obama, McCain, Lieberman, Graham and all the rest of the U.S. Congress/federal government do.
I find this to be exceedingly troubling. And the fact that AIPAC DOES have a stranglehold on our Congress is disgusting to me.
What say you, Uncle Joe?
Sorry you took offense to it. Many people including myself love Jewish people and Israel but HATE zionism and corruption, two things the Israeli government and the US are deeply entrenched in.
Address AIPAC's influence. Take our sites off Iran. Then we can pull out of Iraq. Not much will happen before then.
Jest when did we un-sign the Nuremburg Protocols?
Without a declaration of war this is an illegal invasion and occupation period.
Soldiers are to follow only lawful orders which was added to the oath upon entering the service after we hung a bunch of clowns doing what these clowns are doing.
War criminals led by war criminals,JUSTICE PLEASE
the same as treason?
Obama wants the election to go forward and mend things with McNUT. If Obama thinks these 3 assholes are going to be good to him, He is in a dream world. Obama needs to cut them off at there necks. Look at lieberman, Obama let him keep his chair, then, lieberman teams up with to other asshole repugs and keeps doing the same shit. If Obama wants to get thing done he should look at other Dems who thought they could trust the repugs,Carter,Clinton thought they could trust them. look what happen to them. Obama had better grow a pare on nuts,soon and slam these assholes soon.
that conditions on the ground in iraq could get worse?
well, then the surge was a failure
if it was a failure....he is a failure
if he is a failure, he has no biz being a general
bust him down to buck private and make him do latrine duty
i will be happy to take a dump in all of his latrines and force him to clean my shit
Obama needs to be a Truman to McArthur and get rid of their asses
Doesn't Odierno look an awful lot like "Joe" the plumber?
And how is it that Lieberman is working with McCain and Graham again. Didn't the Democratic Caucus just warn L about that?
some of the dems just cant get there head unstuck from there ass.they should have striped that pice of shit when they had the chance.
the bulshit surge did not do anything, WHAT did stop the fighting was the millions of US dollars the bush admin gave the bad guys to stop starting shit. They were paied to sotp fighting. bush signs for 3 more years to fuck over the GI's to STAY in his war. The congress did not even get to see this paper and it wan NOT IN ENGLISH. He is going to make sure his buds can make billions more in the next 3 years while the US goes down the drain. read the mignight signings bush is doing. tell me he cares about the people in the US. one last thing, this gov from Ill. What? this guy is said he was going to hold millions of dollars fron a kids hospital and people are pissed about. where were these people when bush fucked over 45million kids on helth care @ 5 billion a year but bushs assholes on walstreet gets 700 billion over a weekend.
Bushco shopped for the Generals they wanted to expand US hegemony in the Middle East from Franks (a disaster)to Petraeus (a kiss ass) to Odierno who knows what's best for the US (since Bushco is on the way out). As Woody stated, it's time, after 1/20/09, for Obama to clean house at DoD. Too many Generals have bought into the Military Industrial Complex, Eisenhower prophetically warned us about, loving new, untested, exotic, but mainly expensive systems in lieu of ground pounders. Though this is troubling enough, I believe many general officers, specifically Franks and Petraeus, took personal gain over duty, in agreeing with Bushco tactics (there is no strategy) and violated their oath as officers.
How's that "let LIEberman" keep his Senate chairmanship workin' out for you, dems?
Good move to let one of your next President's most fervent critics keep his position of power.
Politics as usual. Incompetent . . . .
Truman knew what to do with insubordinates.
than many give him credit for.
First, on Gates, I'm convinced that his transition is made much easier with Gates continuing in that position. After the transition, once Obama's people have a good handle on things, the firm order will be issued, "Get out of Iraq according to our treaty obligations!" Those who fail to obey, including Gates, will be summarily and publicly dumped.
Second, I'm also convinced that Obama is going to allow the remaining ideologues to dig their own graves (through disobedience or incompetence) over the next year. A few high-profile firings will give notice to the rest: "Leave now while you still have your honor, or we'll publicly dump you at your first misstep."
I could be wrong, but the signs are too strong for me to ignore. Obama is giving the ideologues a chance to work within the new system and be "bipartisan" ... but the Bus is idling close behind, ready to run over them at the first misstep.
I think Obama is a 'give the benefit of the doubt' kind of guy. Obama, unlike Bush, knows what he wants and what needs to be done, but is not going to do something because someone else says he should or just because he can. I think he's kept Gates on, at least for the time being, simply because Gates is accustomed to picking through this mess made by Dick and George. I think he'll treat Odierno and Petraeus in the same respect. By reaching across to the aisle to the 'Good 'Ole Boys' and making nice he can benefit from their experience also. If push came to shove I don't think Obama will have any problem shoving them out of the ballpark completely if need arises because of internal power struggles. After all, how can one achieve a goal if you are mired down by people constantly trying to undermine on you.
has changed just because he's appointed people that don't fall into the Democratic mold.
That just doesn't give Obama enough credit for smarts. In business, I learned the hard way. When you're put in charge of an unfamiliar situation, surrounded by unfamiliar people, the smart thing to do is change as little as possible until your feet are on the ground.
I think Obama is doing an excellent job of hitting the ground running even though I dislike some of his picks. He can change them anytime he wants. I won't be surprised to see a number of changes somewhere around January of 2010. If I read him correctly, he's selecting people who can keep the engines running until he gets it steered in the right direction. THEN, he'll go to work tuning the engines.
I tend to agree. I have faith in Obama. He has not been sworn in yet-- don't forget. Bush is still president.
I'll judge Obama by what Obama does. Right now, it's a bit like a poker game. Right now is "betting time", judging the table. You don't reveal your hand before you're president. Only then can you claim the pot.
I just wish people would be a bit more patient and realistic.
Whatever happened to the "war czar"?
I just love bi-partisanshipedness, it's really working out great.
Here's the political cover Obama's masters (the unfortunate reference to slavery is intentional) need to keep the troops in Iraq longer than 16 months. "But...But...But...the Generals said we have to stay."
Sorry, but if the Iraqi people (remember them?) want us out, we leave. No matter what some neo-con plant[s] has/have to say about it.
Gen. Odierno obviously doesn't believe he can be relieved of command. This is probably the point where the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Mullen, should step in and take Odierno to the woodshed....if he values his own job.
watched This Week. VP elect Biden pushed back on this very hard. So I don't think there is a problem. I think this is being overblown.
McCain is a retired Navy Captain. Graham is a currently serving Colonel in the Air Force Reserve. They (and Lieberman, of course) certainly know about the principle of civilian control of the military.
Simply put, it means that the judgment that matters is that of the civilian leaders in our government. Military leaders can advise, and they can offer technical expertise as input to the civilian government's decision making process, but ultimately the military leadership MUST be subordinate to the civilian. Once the civilian leadership identifies the objectives and sets the strategy, it's the job of the military leadership to carry out. At that point, whether the military leadership agrees is immaterial.
Bush, McCain, Lieberman, Graham, etc. like putting Petraeus, Odierno, and others who agree with them out front as a transparent attempt to make the conservative policy appear to be apolitical -- if you criticize the policy, you're not supporting the troops.
Shame on McCain, Graham and Lieberman for using our military leaders in this way.
And shame on Franks, Petraeus, Odierno and every other general and admiral who allows himself to be used this way. They do the military a grave injustice by cheapening their positions and their rank.
In neocontard speak : war good, peace bad.
Wait, I'm having a flashback of the Three Stooges 'Who's on First' skit..What losers...
That would be Abbott and Costello.
Aren't McCain, Lieberman, & Graham just throwing their support to Obama's implied choice of Odierno along with his choice of Gates? It's hard to comprehend why Obama would choose someone for his cabinet in a very important position (Gates) who has openly stated his opposition to the incoming CIC's plan.
It seems no body bothered to listen to Obama over the pass 2 years with all his speeches and debates. The Iraq people will decide and Obama has side over and over again we're out of there. The White House appointed Generals like the power and the extra money their getting to continue the conflict. The Iraq Govenment sees the US now in a recession so they have got over 80 billion dollars in surplus and a stronge Stock Maker so they don't really need anything else from the US. Maliki will try for another run and lose and then take is blackmail money and move out of the country. Afghanstan has a President that Bush appointed and the people are wise to that scam now. Look for another Afghan President that is for the people not the USA. These Generals did not protect the troops, they even lied in Congress/Senate for the White House. Rummy is still the man in charge at the Pentagon and everyone in Washington knows it. On Jan. 20th 12:01pm Obama/Biden will take Office and both should retire the puppet Generals from duty.
I hope we haven't come to the place where generals can defy Presidents in this country. It's bad enough that far too many of these brass hats have aligned themselves openly with the Republican party and get away with it without them thinking they can dictate foreign policy.
Wha? He still gets caucus with them and to keep his chairmanship ?
I think the Democrats need to wake up and smell their own rotting body. Joe Lieberman is a 10 pound bag of crap stuffed into a 5 pound bag.
the mans eyes are black with death.
"...the tribal engagement strategy that persuaded Sunnis to abandon the insurgency and join our side"
And what will they do once they stop receiving envelopes full of US cash?
This is the quagmire the Pentagon fears. Once the US pulls out, it will be plainly evident they've lost yet another war. Doesn't look to good for them, does it? Saving their own asses is the most important thing for them. For them, that's means stay.
The Pentagon can not be allowed to operate as a shadow governemnt. Obama will be Commander-in-Chief. (I'm sure he knows that, but he's not that yet.)
I am amazed, although I shouldn't be, that we still don't have some form of group or team that are a cultural experts on Iraq working alongside or guiding the military. The military should not be the primary political and social force in Iraq. That is not what a military does. Furthermore, having the three most worthless men in the US tell Obama that a general should be the commander in chief is treason worthy. The military does not decide US foreign policy. The military is here for one purpose only, to protect the citizens of the United States.
What the hell do they call themselves pulling. The Obams teams is full of strong personalities, and I hope they push-back against this bullshit.
Look at that insane baby killer. [Deleted. Do not advocate violence on this site-Sitemonitor]
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