Dave on 'Countdown': Did Clinton have it worse than Obama?
By David Neiwert Tuesday Sep 29, 2009 6:00am
I went on Countdown last night to chat with Lawrence O'Donnell -- who was filling in for Keith Olbermann -- about Bill Clinton's remarks the other day about the never-ending bloodlust of the "vast right-wing conspiracy".
O'Donnell was critical of Clinton for suggesting that the power of the conspiracy was less today than what he faced -- and regarding that aspect of Clinton's remarks, I agree with him. The reality, as I explained in the segment, is that the spread and reach of the really virulent wingnuttery that plagued Clinton -- the black-helicopter conspiracy theories like Mena, or the Vince Foster suicide, or the Clinton Body Count -- was largely relegated, until later in his tenure, to the fringes of the militia movement.
Obama, by contrast, is not even through his first year as president and he's already being plagued by Birthers and Tenthers and Teabaggers and Death Panels (along with, of course, the obligatory "He's Going To Grab Our Guns" conspiracies).
And it's true, moreover, the Clinton is right that the country has changed demographically since he was president, which means they do not possess the actual political power they held during much of his tenure. But they've made up for the lack of power with a much deeper reach into the mainstream. I dunno about you, but it sure looks to me like the Teabaggers are the new Patriots -- and there's a hell of a lot more of them.
Perhaps more to the point, they've already demonstrated -- by at least temporarily derailing the debate over health-care reform with wingnutty distractions like the "death panels" and the gun-brandishing nutcases showing up at health-care town hall forums -- that they continue to have an outsize influence on the national discourse. Especially because of Fox News and the rest of the mainstream media's willingness to be bullied by them -- led, as always, by the wise media poobahs of the Beltway Village.
That is -- and you can file this under the L'esprit de l'escalier Dept., since I meant to say it in this segment -- what they lack in power they've more than made up for by continuing to pull the media reins and shape the national discourse. They're able to move the media needles still -- which is, of course, the problem. The Village gives movement conservatives far more respect than they deserve, especially at this juncture, with the movement fully in the hands of nutty populist demagogues.
Glenn Beck is as popular as he is because everyone in the "mainstream" is too busy running fawning puff pieces to point out his actual extremism. No one has the guts to explain that these people are driving the Republicans over a cliff into political oblivion.
In The Eliminationists, I do talk a lot about how vicious the campaign against Clinton got to be -- and how many bridges and alliances were built between the far right and mainstream conservatives during those years as a result, particularly in the way right-wing talkers started picking up and transmitting memes from the far right.
Finally, I should add that, while I disagree with Clinton on this point, I generally agreed with the overall thrust of his recent comments, particularly his warning that the "conspiracy" (as it were) remains a potent force, capable of undermining Obama's presidency in unexpected ways. One can't help but suspect that Obama has been naive on this front -- how many times does he have to reach out to Republicans and come back with a chewed-up hand to get it? -- and I suspect Clinton intended to point out the cold reality. To which I can only add: Hear! Hear!
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Finally made number 1.
Agree with David. Things are much worse now. Just look at Uncle Buck.
BTW I just watched the podcast of Countdown and was wondering when this would be posted.
Every one feels like when they are attacked it is worst then someone else.
The issues and policies should be what is making news..
Like what are the policies of a person... We are getting in word battles while our Americans and our country is being sold out right under our feet.
The issue now is What right does the government have to force Americans to buy health insurance from these criminals if they choice not to..
Our government again is passing the buck..
They have s... on us with the free trade bill they passed which outsource over 3.5 million jobs overseas..
They have giving more visa's to foreign workers so they can come into our country and take the jobs they have left here.
They have given tax cuts to the top 10 percent of the rich while squeezing the last penny out of Americans to pay for the services they provide to them by the use of our military.....
They gave the auto manufacturers our tax dollars so they could outsource more of our American jobs overseas and replace their funds while cutting salaries and laying out workers..
They gave money to the Global Banking Empire so they could build their monopoly larger by buying out smaller banks and building up their banking system overseas..
They have created legislation to destroy our constitution , bill of rights , democracy and freedom with laws like the Patriotic act.. Where they can now spy as they please for no other reason than they wish to..
They can pick you up anywhere they wish , with no reason , no warrant , no phone call and do any d... thing they wish and never tell anyone a d... thing about it... Some people have just vanished with no paper work..
They are giving the courts , police and military more freedom and the right to do as they please to Americans and interpret our laws as they d... well please...
We can not run a traffic light , have any drugs which they claim are illegal , they control our consumption of what we drink , eat and tell us where we can go or what we can do.. While they do any thing they wish and break any law they wish..
They are arrogant and out of control and looks as if they are daring us to complain about anything they do..
Look at the new war device they use on the G20 demonstrators...
Was Iraq house to house break-ins and the equipment a practice for what they plan to do with Americans if they do not do as they are told...
And he has been faced with nothing short of condemnation from the left.
All these lefties demanding their pet issue be first and foremost.
* The LGBT community wants DADT and DOMA done away with or THEY will sit on their hands next election.
* healthcare proponents want a perfect bill or they too will sit on their hands next election
* Anti-war proponents want us out of Iraq and Afghanistan or they will sit on their hands next election.
* anti-Bush proponents want all Bush policies and practices reversed or . ..
I think you might get the picture here. The only real question is how many of the above want Palin for president?
The left was much slower to turn on Bubba. For some odd reason in less than a year Obama faces more opposition from the left than anything. Sad really.
These are all legitimate policy differences and Obama personally misled me, his administration is naive, and we are not going to act like Republicans under Bush and I don't watch television but the American people surely don't support and capitalism is dead but it is all corporate owned and controlled. So there.
If Obama reveals the identity of the CIA assassins of JFK and their corporate funders before the next election, e-mail me. I threw my phone out with the TV.
as the left should
i couldn't disagree with your POV more.
Hold up Sara Palin as a bogeyman and there's really nothing the "center" won't fall for.
Against DOMA and DADT? Well, Sara Palin and the teabaggers would have all the gays killed.
Against pointless wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and perhaps Iran? Well, Sarah Palin and the teabaggers would cause nukular annihilation.
Against a corporate health care bill that fixes nothing and is merely a give-away of hundreds of billions of dollars? Well, Sara Palin and the teabaggers would get rid of Medicare.
Against Bush policies as blatant rip-offs by the generational wealth crowd? Well, Sara Palin and the teabaggers are really really scary.
There is really nothing the "center" won't endorse if the Right simply moves further to the right. Some in the "center" will do their math, find the new "middle," and feel oh so wise. Others will take their Manichean view of the world and decide that whatever opposes the scary must be good.
And others will call the Left stupid for not accepting their adolescent world view.
For Obama it's fewer people but they are louder. Hence, not as "vast".
Anyway, IMO, Obama was foolish for even trying to reach out to these people. Exactly like I predicted.
I have yet to understand why Obama thinks that we need to have 'bipartisanship". The rethugs have time and time again shown that they will not bargian in good faith.
Asking for compromise is like asking a madman not to kill you, but maybe we can meet in the middle, like it will be less egregious if he merely cuts off a leg.
I'm watchin my team get their butts whupped on Monday Night Football!
Dammitalltohell!
attempts to be conciliatory to the 'Thugs. Of course, Clinton has gotten quite a few years under his belt since his first experiences with the 'gators-- newt, rush, etc. I'm hoping Obama is a quick learner, but he doesn't have many hands left...
Good job on the TV, BTW.
I whole heartedly agree.Things are much worse now. They have had years to purge everyone outside of their very narrow,radical tent. That they have been doing. Now it is down to the pure nutty core.
Of course this continual purge and finding a new enemy everytime they turn around is eventually going to lead to cult status..I think they are already there. How long can you look for enemies before you need to find a few friends. How long can you call fellow citizens what they have been calling them before they turn on them en mass? If you think I am a terrorist or blah blah blah..im not looking at you in a favorable way. This is the way they treat everyone not right down their line. Good luck with that.
No. Obama has it worse. It's nice to know the GOPers are going to make all of our lives a living hell for the next 7 years.
Oh, and Handypants, I agree.
The GOP has barely gotten warmed up .
You mean that they didn't revel in making our lives a living hell for the previous 8? Hell, they screwed up the country almost beyond repair; they did it intentionally, and they enjoyed themselves the whole time. It's like...
Conservatives hate America.
The reason Clinton feels like the vast right wing was stronger in his Presidency was the election of a Republican House in 1994 and the use of power in that institution to launch investigations. We shall see what happens if the Republicans regain control of either the House or Senate during Obama's presidency.
To state that it is worse for Obama because the number and reach of the bloviators is wider is accurate, and it has started earlier in his term. That may be because it took the vast right wing a while under Clinton to figure out that the constant attack mode worked.
The main similarity to me is the degree to which the opposition personalizes the president as evil. This is not unique to the right (Bush family evil empire, the Chimperor, etc.) but it is characterized by a large number of people willing to believe evil deeds and intent on the part of an elected leader which are made up out of whole cloth.
The biggest differences are race and the absence (thus far) of genuine hate and vitriol directed at the First Lady.
Geez, they point-blank accused him of murdering Ron Brown, Vince Foster, and dozens of other people. In fact, there was a report compiled by an Indiana lawyer upon which former Congressional Rep. Bill Dannemyer based a 1994 letter to Congressional leaders, warning them of the "suspicious" circumstances under which those with ties to Clinton died. The report was called "Clinton Body Count: Coincidence or Kiss of Death?"
See http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodyc...
Then, somehow, an investigation into alleged financial irregularities (which Starr could not prove despite spending tens of millions of dollars in connection with his investigation) morphed into a scandal about Clinton's dalliance with an intern? And we payed for this?
The Obama issue is a little different. He's squeaky-clean (at least relative to Clinton), and he's black, so the right has, predictably, tried to paint him as unamerican, as if being black and American are mutually exclusive.
I think we're looking at the past through rose-colored glasses if we conclude that Clinton was not subject to some pretty noisome criticism. Indeed, I think it's safe to say that the left/right schism entrenched itself as a result of the Right's attacks on him during his presidency.
I think your reply pretty much agrees with the point I was trying to make. I just left out the details of charges made up out of whole cloth.
I do recall:
Whitewatergate -- an investigation into anything that cost more than Watergate, but had no results...
or how about:
the Star Report?
At about $40 million, we spent more than the cost for law enforcement in Arkansas!
All we got was a report that read like a bad attempt at porn.
I at least expected GOOD porn for that price!
a scratch and sniff centerfold in Cigar Aficianado?
... but calling Bush evil can not be shrugged off as a simple attempt at personalization, it is/was a statement of fact.
The right called Clinton evil, and now it does the same with Obama, based upon fabricated (for the most part) accusations.
That is a biiiiiig difference, IMHO.
dave should be on nbc more often.... C&L is one of the few blogs that actually gets it....
the rightwing blowhards are on overload only 8 months into the new term.... they will need to keep on ratcheting up the rhetoric as time moves on, you will see one of the mindless who follow blindly do a McVeigh eventually.... and when that happens they will say that it was a dem who did it to make them look bad....
But I do think the name of blogs has something to do with the willingness of network television to invite people from them.
"Crooks and Liars" presumes a judgement has been made before coverage begins. "Daily Kos" sounds like a mineral supplement. "National Review Online" on the other hand, sounds like, I don't know, what shall we say, "real America" instead of "bat shit crazy."
Was just speaking with a customer after a sale about photography, and he was pretty cool, he described how he advised his daughter to by a certain camera strap, and wrap around her arm when she was in public to make it harder for thieves to snatch and grab...then this is where the conversation went south...he said some Democrat tried to take the camera...he then said, I hope you aren't a Democrat, I replied that I was, then asked him, "How did you know the thief was a Democrat? It's not like we have a uniform." Then he backpedaled, and said he was just kidding....what an asshole.
The other side seems to think all minorities are Democrats unless they appear on FOX or are the warm up minister on CBN.
"How did you know the thief was a Democrat? It's not like we have a uniform."
http://www.faniq.com/blog/Tennessee-Jail-Goes...
I really wanted to tear into his BS assumption...BUT...he's a customer, and I can't do that and expect to keep him coming back.
for calling the wanker on his lie.
And a hearty TFB right back atcha!
I certainly hope you told him he was an asshole... after you asked him what he has done for Glenn Beck today.
I just smiled when I called him out. No raised voice or flailin about...
I was taken aback slightly...someone who was seemingly intelligent, and well educated, was so prejudiced...
It's a shame really.
David you were really good on Olbermann/O'Donnell. You represented very well. As usual your points were well thought out and delivered calmly yet they hit hard. Floated like a butterfly and stung like a bee.
Cool
being Capitalism is not working anymore and all.
in real life.
bigger then they really are.
on radio.
on substance.
I insist that you give up blogging and become a regular on the t.v. machine.
Honestly, there are very few people who will talk straight about what is going on in this country. We progressives need people like you blanketing the airwaves to counter the neverending wingers, timid talk show hosts on msm, and, of course, the evil doers on fox.
Maybe even the administration will get a clue and wise up to how rolled they are.
element.
I *lurve* ya, Dave, but I think naivete has been wrongly accused, here. The first image that came to my tinfoil brain was that picture from about 3-4 years ago of Poppy Bush and Bill Clinton in a golf cart, girning for the cameras. And then, right there in my brain, Bill's face dissolving into Barack Obama's.
There's not enough on Obama's "plus column" (and quite a bit in the "minus column) yet to allow him the possibility of naivete. Money and power seem more like possibilities to me.
(I enjoyed meeting you at the Brave New Films event a few weeks back, btw! Your little girl's a doll!) :)
Anna Granfors
Los Angeles
I wonder if the wingnuts are shooting their load prematurely. What more can they come up with? They are so far out there now that their credibility is pretty much shot. It seems like the Birther infomercial is so far over the edge that they can't be taken seriously ever again. Even Tweety was blown away (Tweety said that if Obama were to come up with the documents that these idiots want, he asked if they would leave the country after forcing Obama to do something that nobody else from Hawaii has to do to prove their citizenship.).
The thing is, what more can they do? I think/hope the main stream are done with these idiots. Calling Obama a communist/socialist/Nazi and this birther crap and the 10ther crap and saying that he hates America and all the other idiocy is leaving these jokers on the outside. I sure hope so anyway.
Yeah, that's what I said in 1955 about this guy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3w7w58CREY
Some of what happened to Clinton and is happening to Obama is the numbers. Almost ever week there was a new "scandal" that was headline news for the right wing and picked up by the MSM. With a little bit of investigation 99.9% were just made up silly crap. Most people would just move on but after years of constant "scandals" the idea that there must be something there, some fire under the constant cloud of smoke became conventional knowlege. With things like Obama's speach to school kids, some kids singing a pro Obama song, the nothing scandle of ACORN and constantly falsely tieing Obama to ACORN, Birthers and Tenthers and Teabaggers and Death Panels soon the conventional wisdom will hold that this is an adminstration riddled with "scandals" so there must be something there. That also made it easier for the Bush crime fimily because people got so tired of the scandals during Clinton.
The thing is people have to take the "scandals" seriously. The right wing resembles more closely a soap opera than a serious political policy discussion. I'm still in wonderment on how successful these PT Barnums are. And that is all they are.
Clinton was a coward then, he is a coward now. He told us to fuck off yesterday as he spoke glowingly of an old bat in Maine that wants to kill us. Now billy wants to kill us. What is it about Arkansas? Is it because you share a name with Kansas? Is it because the Ozarks really are full of people running from canoeing homebodies?
Screw off Bill. You didn't know what you were up against? What silly talk. You made deals with the warts of humanity and freaking invaded yugoslavia because we supported Serbia. Why the hell didn't you make eagleburger your deputy king?
You can ruin your whole life with one mistake. You made it yesterday for me. I will never listen to anything you have to say again knowing that is is probably well thought out feces, flavored with whale meat.
on the type of critter which produced the feces and the type of whale used to flavor it. Monkey shit with beluga is a favorite down at the old left wing Cafe Rhetoric Eliminationist.
Bill Clinton kissed those eternally hateful right wing fucks throughout his overrated Presidency...all while they lambasted every move he made(even when he did their bidding), culminating with his impeachment when those assholes found out about his uncontrollable love for BBW.
"They're able to move the media needles still"
i think this is a poor read. the rightwing astroturfers are not the ones 'moving the media's needles'--it is a convenient excuse for continued skewed reporting.
David goes on to say, "The Village gives movement conservatives far more respect than they deserve", which goes straight to your point. It's a symbiotic relationship only one side is being used and doesn't know it.
It's not a conspiracy, it's just heathering on national scale.
Remember this movie?
http://www.thehuntingofthepresident.com/
$70 million spent in hunting Clinton?....
The hunting of the current target is just as massive...
only it has been privatized....
the guns are just as big...and perhaps more real.
"The Bible is the authoritative Word of God and contains all truth."--Bill Clinton
"You know, my faith is one that admits some doubt."--Barack Obama
1992 electoral map:
→ http://politicalmaps.org/wp-content/uploads/2...
1996 electoral map:
→ http://politicalmaps.org/wp-content/uploads/2...
2008 electoral map:
→ http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/results/pre...
It may help to open the snapshot(s) in separate tabs to enable a quick comparison?
Governor of Arkansas
United States Senator from Illinois
Political Divide, 92' 96' 00' 04'
http://elections.nytimes.com/2008/results/pre...
"...and perhaps more real."
DEFINITELY more real. Just after the election, I checked out FR..wow...I mean W O W...even pictures of rifles with scopes on blocks - posters saying they just cleaned them up...ammunition draped over the table...one poster even said below his picture that ..."we got a lot more to take care of..." I know there were t-shirts with Clinton's pic on them with a target over it...but these are OVERT and in-your-face.
For all the vitriol ..... the Rightwankers have it all down pat. As far as President Obama goes, I think I'm the one who's been naive...I fully expected us to be OUT of Iraq, of Afghanistan ...NOW...had the Bush cabal IN JAIL awaiting trial...etc.
That said, I think it has been worse against President Obama, and YES, I DO think a lot of it IS RACIALLY-based. Not all, but a lot...
Clinton cracks me up.."Mr. smoochzing babs and GWHB..." So I think he really has no clue as to how bad it has gotten.
Chris Matthews managed to mangle truth once again. He mocked Clinton's remarks by trying to make the argument that the "right-wing conspiracy" was related only to the Lewinski scandal. In truth, this conspiracy - well documented in numerous books, including "The Hunting of the President" - began at the outset of Clinton's presidency (in fact, months before) and continued unabated for years. We even have a well-known name for it: Whitewater. This conspiracy involved all the then-existing organs of the echo machine.
This closely parallels what has occurred, to a greater degree of public volume, with Obama.
I have this theory evolving as I watch the MSM and the rise of blogs/cable among the decline of print newspapers/mags. It seems to me the ratings/viewers/twitters race is amplifying all the worst, simply because that's what gets and holds peoples attention. Its a feedback loop of behavior-media reaction, (more Beck-isms and hot rhetoric from everyone from OReilley to Olbermann to etc.) and most of all what was have pointed out in this post. Outrage squared? It will continue to accelerate so hold on for the ride!
Look at the smaller number of comments Dave generates when he covers himself doing good than when he covers Beck being bad.
we fight this trend as we type even if it is to produce these "meta-comments".
... and you did really well. Your delivery was much more relaxed than your last appearance - and you smiled a little, here and there, which is always a positive for the audience. Your presence on 'the TV machine' is a welcome change of pace. You'll morph into a seasoned pro before you know it. Good job!
nobody wants to address this issue in the correct way.
these people are bullies plain and simple.
and the one and only way to deal with a bully is to kick the ever lovin shit out of them.
i know that flys in the face of progressive values but somebody needs to fuck these people up.
and i'm not necessarily talking about a physical beating, although i'm not automatically opposed to that.
most of the time, all these people need is a good dose of reality. spoken really, really harshly. and they wilt.
These teabaggers are a ridiculously small and powerless minority. With all that MSM hype, and all that financing, they still couldn't get enough people at their national rally to fill a decent size football stadium.
They are shiny objects heavily magnified by moneyed interests to provide an unacceptable alternative to what the moneyed interests wish to do.
I'm thinking "No, this isn't the time for bullshit like this."
This is the time to be frying Blue Dogs and Republicans over the level of corruption it takes to betray the American people for bribe money from HMOs and Big Pharma.
This is the time to be reassuring all Blue Dogs that, yes, your political careers are over, and you might as well get your last bits of betrayal done now, and secure your upcoming jobs as kept puppies for your masters.
Well, if you hadn't noticed, we do a lot of that too.
But people who get fixated on the micro-politics miss an important part of the big picture: The reasons their efforts to advance a progressive agenda fail are all bound up in the right's ability to mobilize its wingnuts who shout and scream and throw tantrums until they get their way. The problems we have passing health-care reform are directly related to Glenn Beck's demagoguing.
Even after Beck's demagoguing, polls still show a huge majority in favor of a serious public option. The right's "ability to mobilize its wingnuts" resulted in a somewhat large picnic at the capital mall.
The politicians fighting health care reform aren't doing so because they fear the heavily defeated right. Remember this? No politician fears a party with 22% favorable rating. Moreover, no heavily financed demagogue could claim any sort of success with a 68% disapproval rating.
People who get fixated on the culture war miss an important part of the big picture: the culture war is meant to be a distraction, a wedge.
No politician fears a party with 22% favorable rating.
Harry Reid does. As do most Senate Democrats.
Teabaggers are nothing more than an excuse for corporate Dems to do what the corporate Dems want to do anyway.
The polling numbers should scare any politician away from opposing such popular mandates, but the teabaggers provide both a faux opposition and a terrible alternative should voters shy away from the corporatist agenda.
As they adopt corporate policies, Reid and his ilk can claim to have fought the right (meaning a handful of teabaggers and not moneyed interests) and further scare a distracted population with a teabagger alternative should they wish to vote against the corporate Dems.
I didn't get the sense Clinton was saying he had it worse than Obama. It sounded to me like he was talking specifically about -- not just political power -- but political power in connection with mid-term elections. Obviously that's where demographics will really make a difference (if they're going to).
back in Clinton's day as well.
Back in '95, the Clinton administration did something or other with National Historic and Scenic Rivers, or whatever they called it. The Wabash was set to be one of those rivers, and the public announcement of that turned up a buildingful of screaming crazies yelling about how the feds were going to use that designation to confiscate their property and guns. And in case you think the claims weren't as nutty backthen, one of them said that she had read in Readers Digest that the Carter administration had given away Yellowstone to China.
I disagree. The Clinton hate was mainstreamed very early on. Before he was elected even. The MSM bought right in to the 'Slick Willy' image and all the claims about drug running and murders when he was Governor. Obama has some support in the mainstream media. Clinton never really did,
Dave said: "No one has the guts to explain that these people are driving the Republicans over a cliff into political oblivion."
Agreed. It's a head scratcher. But for chrissakes, let's leave 'em in the dark as long as possible! LOL
The ignorant who listen and then believe the ridicious, proven lies from hate monguering, Reslug morons, obviously didn't make it past the 6th grade. This is the make-up of the racist, Reslug party now.
Clinton had it rough, no doubt, but there is a lot of racial reasons behind the hate for Obama -- and that's a much bigger demon in the shadows than Clinton ever had to deal with.
I do have to disagree with the "Rush is bigger now than he was with Clinton" statements on the show though. Clinton is who put Rush on the map, just like Obama is who is putting Beck on the map. If McCain was president, Beck wouldn't be nearly as popular as he is now.
Rush was at his peak of popularity in the Clinton years. Rush had his radio show, he had his own TV show, his books were selling like hot cakes, he was everywhere, just like Beck is today.
Beck knows Obama is his cash cow, and so he's going to milk it for all it's worth. Which is what he's doing.
Rush and Beck are the TV Evangelists of politics. Their "satan" is a Democratic president. The fact that it's a black democratic president is bonus. So while Rush may say "I hope he fails" I can assure you he really doesn't want him to because that will effect his income.
Of course the irony is Rush and Beck wallow in their present day popularity and think they'll be just as popular if a republican was in office. It's no coincidence that Rush's downhill slide started after Clinton was out of office.
In 1991, Ailes convinced a syndicator to bring Rush Limbaugh from radio to television √
and that's a much bigger demon in the shadows than Clinton ever had to deal with.
Not really. The main core of Clinton haters were racists from Arkansas. These were the people that the Scaifettes made a beeline for when Clinton became President. They saw Clinton as a race traitor and n----- lover, which is as bad as actually being black to them. See about Justice Jim Johnson in The Hunting Of The President.
Agree about Rush. He was seen as a kingmaker for a party on the rise back in the mid '90's, back when Rush Limbaugh Is A Big Fat Idiot came out. He's now seen as the de facto head of a dying party.
...of all.
Bill's vision of himself as the ultimate victim is one of the things that made it harder to get the Right Wing to take any responsibility for its reckless disregard for the truth. On the other hand, even if Bill has always seen himself as more of a victim than he is, I am reminded of that ageless piece of wisdom that says "Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean no one's out to get me."
What is different now is the trajectory of the Republican Party. When Clinton took office and for the rest of his tenure, the GOP was ascendant. Now, they are teetering. While it's entirely possible that the ever fickle American voter will give them a big victory at the polls in thirteen months, it is also possible that they are on the brink of sealing their fate as a minority party for years to come. Unfortunately, the one thing that could guarantee that -- a vibrant, responsible Democratic Party -- is not even remotely possible.
So, I disagree with Clinton. The GOP was unquestionably bad when he was president, but as the Republicans' real power has dwindled, their irresponsibility and disregard for the truth has grown.
The GOP was unquestionably bad when he was president, but as the Republicans' real power has dwindled, their irresponsibility and disregard for the truth has grown.
republicanism is a mental illness!
Will someone please pull all the Public records on the NAZI bush FAMILY, to include THE Nazi agenda of the Right Wing, show how the TALKING MONKEY< SUPREME COURT APPOINTED BALLOT BOX FIXED (OHIO),CORPORATE APPROVED ,War Criminal bush and his SPINELESS,Gutless, AMERICAN TRAITOR (DRAFT DODGING SCUM BAG) cheney, purposely and with clear conscience set forth to DESTROY this Country and how the NAZI RIGHT WING and CHRISTIAN are furthering those INTERESTS, it is ALL a MATTER of public record, show how the SOCIALIST CORPORATIONS and FASCISTS Corporations are out to DESTROY this COUNTRY TIE all the loose ends together.Remember Sig Heil every SCUM BAG CHRISTIAN republican you see, spit on them they LOVE IT.
They have thier adgenda. In the process they lie to the not so bright and they believe them. The bottom I believe you will find are mainly racists. I have met a bunch of them. I could take you to a dozen of them in this area. Those are the ones that I know of, I am not really sure how many others there are. These are really bright people, NOT!
republicanism is a mental illness! Commit one if you can!
Everyone is right to say the Blogs today can make life difficult. Even if it is a small minority there are devote followers.
So I guess Clinton had it easy?? No and here is why. The GOP had control of both the house and the senate. So they were able to hold kangaroo court hearings to investigate constantly. Unlike blogs, you cannot ignore a hearing in the senate. That is what makes the right wing nut jobs so bothersome.
To have a host who doesn't ask a guest a loaded question, then allow half a sentence at best before shouting him down, calling him names, telling him to shut the hell up, or cutting off the mike a la FOX style of 'infotainment' akin to the Romans throwing prisoners to the lions for the delection of the hysterical masses.
Prefessional television journalism - what an incredibly luxury!
Oh, and you were pretty good, too, David. Well done. :)
They were after Clinton before he became president, but I don't remember death threats. By that standard, Obama has it worse.
The right wing is basically throwing a fit, lying on their back and kicking their legs in anger that they are out of power. But that doesn't mean that this isn't serious. They claim that Obama is destroying the Constitution. But Obama isn't the one who passed the Patriot Act. Obama isn't the one who used torture to make America less safe than it was in 2000. It was the Republicans in charge of Congress who refused to investigate the Bush Administration and find out what actually was going on. And it is the right wing who are making death threats and suggesting a military coup -- both of which would end the Constitution as our Founding Fathers established it.
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