Mark McGwire admits to using steroids says 'roids didn't help him. ESPN acts like his PR firm.
I know this story isn't political, but it does have ramification on a media level. And when the sports media tries to whitewash an event it only hurts the public at large. And we cover media extensively on C&L.
Mark McGwire finally admitted to what most baseball fans already knew: He used steroids throughout his career and during the magnificent 1998 HR chase to break Roger Maris' single-season record of sixty-one home runs.
Mark McGwire finally came clean, admitting he used steroids when he broke baseball's home run record in 1998.
McGwire said in a statement sent to The Associated Press on Monday that he used steroids on and off for nearly a decade.
"It's very emotional, it's telling family members, friends and coaches, you know, it's former teammates to try to get a hold of, you know, that I'm coming clean and being honest," he said during a 20-minute telephone interview, his voice repeatedly cracking. "It's the first time they've ever heard me, you know, talk about this. I hid it from everybody."
"I'm sure people will wonder if I could have hit all those home runs had I never taken steroids," McGwire said. "I had good years when I didn't take any, and I had bad years when I didn't take any. I had good years when I took steroids, and I had bad years when I took steroids. But no matter what, I shouldn't have done it and for that I'm truly sorry."
He wants a new job in Baseball so he finally tells the truth with a well oiled PR staff behind him. ESPN came on in the afternoon and did a 30 minute infomercial in support of McGwire which was sickening. They didn't have on anybody who thought Mark was a cheater. And after I watched some of his interview with Bob Costas on the MLB Network I almost threw up and felt compelled to write this post. He has the nerve to say steroids didn't help him hit HR's and he uses his earlier background as proof of that to Costas.
Listen Mark, there were plenty of high school and college level superstars that never panned out in the majors. Steve Balboni was a marvel in AAA but couldn't make it in the bigs. How many players didn't have a career in the Majors because they didn't juice up? According to him 'roids didn't help him at all. Costas pressed him on it, but he would not budge. As I said, it was a disgraceful performance. The Cardinals have to be behind this 100%.
This is a complete sham and his half hearted apology is ridiculous. How do you think the Maris family feels now after being party to the scam back in 1998 when he hit home run number 62 and they stood there watching him? ESPN's Baseball Tonight acted like part of the PR campaign designed by the Cardinals to ease him back into the spotlight. And McGwire is only being hired to be the damn hitting coach.
Here's the type of articles that was written when the magnificent 1998 HR chase to break Roger Maris' single-season record of sixty-one home runs happened.
Mark McGwire completed an amazing and wonderful journey into baseball history tonight, finishing a mission that has captivated a nation, revived a sport and constructed a legend. With one more mighty swing, he became the first man in history to hit 62 home runs in a season, surpassing the previous – and once seemingly untouchable – record of 61 by Roger Maris in 1961.
"Absolutely incredible," an emotional McGwire said later. "What can I say? I'm almost speechless. It's been awesome. The last week and a half my stomach has been turning and my heart beating a million miles a minute. What a feat." Play was stopped for 11 minutes as McGwire and 49,987 fans at Busch Stadium soaked up the moment. After McGwire's St. Louis Cardinals defeated the Cubs, 6-3, Major League Baseball Commissioner Bud Selig conducted an on-field ceremony.
The media drooled all over him. I watched that chase at the time between McGwire and Sosa and the fans were really into it. Baseball had recently come off the strike year in 1994 and they needed a shot in the arm. Maybe it was a shot in the ass, as it turns out.
In a room filled with humbled heroes, Mark McGwire hemmed and hawed the most.His voice choked with emotion, his eyes nearly filled with tears, time after time he refused to answer the question everyone wanted to know: Did he take illegal steroids when he hit a then-record 70 home runs in 1998 — or at any other time? Asked by Rep. Elijah Cummings, D-Md., whether he was asserting his Fifth Amendment right not to incriminate himself, McGwire said: "I'm not here to talk about the past. I'm here to be positive about this subject."
Asked whether use of steroids was cheating, McGuire said: "That's not for me to determine." To a couple of other questions, all he would say is: "I'm retired."
It's disgusting watching the baseball pundits try to justify his actions. ESPN sends on Bobby Knight in the middle of BT after their stable of analysts all stay on the same " I'm so happy for him" script. It's finally over for him. Bobby Knight, a friend of McGwire's called Mark a first ballot HOFer who only got some bad legal advice. I was expecting McGwire's family to go on next.
I'm writing about this because it looks to me like the media is part of the McGwire Resurrection Project. It's interesting the the Giants aren't trying to do the same for Barry Bonds. This is a well orchestrated event by the Cardinals and some of the sports media seems to be a willing participant. Tony Clark is a new member of the Baseball Tonight team, and he looked like he was reading a script from the teleprompter as he whispered sweet nothings into the ear of McGwire.
Nice try, Tony LaRussa. Nice try, ESPN. Nice try, Cardinals.
for lying to Congress?
dandy
My advice: Strip Barry Bonds of his lifetime home run record and Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire and Sammy Sosa of their season home run totals.
Hello
As far as I see Hank Aaron still appears the home run leader of all time and Roger Maris appears the home run leader for a season.
Why? because the usurpers allegedly used steroids.
I don't mind if someone honestly establishes a new home run record for all time or for a season but these people did it dishonestly, just as dishonest as the Black Sox did to get money for throwing a world series in 1919.
I see a compromise: Set Barry Bonds final Home run total at 743 and Mark McGwire, Barry Bonds and Sammy Sosa's home run total at 58 for a season.
As for Pete Rose going into the hall of fame. I propose a compromise. Let him go into the hall of fame Posthumously.
Let the sports writers put him on the ballot with the understanding that Rose goes in after he goes to the great ball field in the sky and not a second before. So he won't get in right away but he will see that he will eventually get in when he sees St. Peter.
Your comments?
Hall unitl they put in Buck O'Niel first.
No one who knows the game well would dream of putting O'Neil in as a player, because he wasn't all that great as a player. He seemed to be a good manager in the Negro Leagues, but not great. So what's left to consider? His time as a Major League scout and roving instructor, and how many guys are in the HoF for their contributions in those capacities? I'm not certain, but I think the number is 0.
Again, I like O'Neil, but I got to like him for much the same reason I got to like historian Shelby Foote: Because they were both charming while sharing anecdotes on camera in different Ken Burns' documentaries.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
and had a .288 lifetime average. He coached the monarchs for 8 years and to two titles, and missed two years because he served in the Navy during WWII. He then went on to scout for the Cubs and later became the First Black Coach In MLB.
He again went onto scouting earning an award for being the "scout of the year" (o.k. it may not be much).
But he then "led" the effort for the establishement of the Negro Leagues Baseball Museum. He was named the Honorary Chairman and remained so until his death.
He was memeber of the Baseball Hall of Fame Veterans Committe for 19 years and was instrumental in getting 17 members of the N.L's inducted.
Was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom, and after his death, was given a lifetime achievment award by the Hall of Fame.
The HOF has managers, sportswriters, umpires, even players who played for "1" year. Buck was so well beloved a few minor league teams let him bat (I'm sure he was walked) when he was well into his 90's.
I don't know what to think if someone gives his ENTIRE life to the betterment of the league and it's history and is not rewarded with enshrinment - it shows a fault with the HOF, not the player.
and they waited for Barry before there was any outrage.
As for Rose, never! He is still arrogant. He was a man in power and he bet on his own team. No excuse, No hall of fame. He shamed baseball. He threw it all away when he did what he did.
Some stuff you can't make up!
they were illegal for use without a prescription at the time, just as they are now.
Baseball, however, did not have a ban on their use.
Laws re: their use have changed dramatically since then and now you are a dangerous, roid rage felon if you use something in the steroid class.
However, many steroids are still, as they always have been, legal to purchase and use under a doctor's supervision and prescription.
McGwire was playing. I lived in NorCal during that time and getting roids at my gym was a hush hush thing. The owner of the gym did time for selling them in 1990.
McGwire is full of crap to say they didn't help him. What a load, I recall being in a sticking spot in my workouts and couldn't get past it and tried a single 10 cc shot of deca to see if it would help me break out of it. I was able to lift 15 to 20 pounds more in 3 days on just a single shot and worked out like a monster for the next week needing little recovery time.
Goodnight, Frau Blücher
each steroid stays detectable in the body for a different length of time.
If I recall some of my past reading, athletes shy away from Deca because it is detectable up to 18 months or so after injection.
They like testosterone and hGH because they have a much shorter detection signature.
that's what steroids are supposed to do, as you found out. They help in the gym with building muscle and you can put on a lot of muscle fast because you can work out like a monster and recover like a comic book superhero.
What they don't do is make you a better hitter. They'll increase bat speed and you'll hit the ball further, but they won't help you hit the ball...Look, all these guys were already good hitters and they took juice to make them long (or longer) ball hitters. McGwire hit 49 homers his rookie season and he was clean then...
I have no problem banning him from baseball or the hall of fame or trying to bring him up on criminal charges or contempt of congress (even though he took the 5th), but let's keep the discussion straight...
You just can't "set" home run totals.
Just do what Hank Aaron suggests and put an asterisk by every name.
Oh and no Charlie Hustler in the Hall....Ever.
"I can't keep doing this on my own with these...people."
ESPN is to sports what Fox is to news.
Let's see if the old white guy joins the young black woman in prison for lying about steroid use.
(Hint: Do not hold yer breath)
"I can't keep doing this on my own with these...people."
LOL work it man!!!!
Marion Jones did her time, but I believe she also lied to a Grand Jury.
IIRC, MM evaded questions of Congress.
So Big Mac says:
"I'm not here to talk about the past. I'm here to be positive about this subject."
And not one member of congress points out that he is not the guy that picks the topic? That he is there to answer questions about any subject that comes to him?
What exactly is the point of a Congressional hearing if they allow that kind of crap? Just ask the question. If he fails to answer ask him to take the fifth. If he wobbles slam down the gavel and take the cheater to the basement.
We have for much too long watched folks make a mockery out of congressional testimony. Fix it or drop the practice.
those players names on all their records who were found to have used steroids.
Here's the *link:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hof09/news/stor...
What do you think of that idea John?
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
Babe Ruth = The Discrimination era.
Mark McGwire = The Steroid era.
. . . who used other performance-enhancing substances, e.g., amphetamines, cocaine, etc. And while we're at it, let's tag every NFL Chamopinship/Superbowl winner from the late Sixties until at least the mid-90s, who all were harboring players using banned substances.
The funny thing is that McGwire suggests that steroids didn't help him hit homeruns. Anyone who believes this silliness (including Aaron, who has stated that steroids didn't help Bonds hit a baseball) is beyond help, and really, truly naive as to how steroids work and how they make the user feel.
Look, while MgWire's use is really indefensible, steroid use will not make you hit the ball better. Further? Yes, if you hit the gym hard, you will get stronger, but it does nothing for the skill required to hit a ball. It doesn't improve that.. So a lot of his shots that would have been triples or long doubles became home runs. If he hadn't used he still might have broken the record for single season, because he was clean as a rookie and hit 49. And I'm not naive about steroid use or what it does to a person. Even feeling invincible doesn't help hand-eye coordination...
of home runs would have been harmless flyballs dropping softly into the leather of a Rawlings.
Here is the argument I believe is coherent:
Without steroids, Mac breaks no HR records.
Here is an other angle:
How many pitchers lost games because of Mac's hitting that they would have otherwise won and were their bonuses or earnings impacted negatively by those facts?
The media drooled all over him. I watched that chase at the time between McGwire and Sosa and the fans were really into it. Baseball had recently come off the strike year in 1994 and they needed a shot in the arm.
Baseball's real shot in the arm came in 1995 when Cal Ripken broke Lou Gehrig's streak of 2,130 consecutive games. I'm enough of a hardcore baseball fan to appreciate that breaking Gehrig's streak was even more of an impressive feat than hitting more than 61 homers in one season.
I was a hardcore fan then, and now. I agree about Ripken. But what McGwire and Sosa did was bring back the regular fans. Given the number of players who have admitted their use of PEDs so far, I'm giving McGwire a pass as of now.
Others can judge his baseball future, he was a special player way before 1998.
they ask him that?
I can't remember exactly what he said at the hearings but if he was under oath and did lie, should he not be going to jail?
is intended to be a factual statement
to resort to taking drugs to increase endurance?
Everyone put their heads in the sand and enjoyed the shows.
Organized Baseball was completely complicit.
That's a lie being propagated by users in order to avoid the conclusion that they significantly enhance performance in virtually every physical endeavor.
please...faster, stronger, more endurance, still doesn't equate with hitting the ball well...I know (and knew) a lot of tremendous athletes who couldn't hit a baseball off a t-stand.
Dont apologize John, didn't some smart dude once name this blog "Crooks & Liars" ? McWired is BOTH.
Hey Chubby Douchebag: Admit you cheated and then demand that your own name be removed from every record and HOF entry, then I'll believe it.
I'm Boycotting NewsCorp! Heres what not to buy: http://www.cjr.org/resources/index.php?c=news...
It's amazing how rage can skew one's vision. I have seen all the recent media about all of this and he looks to be in great shape. Here is what I would like to know. All of you McGuire haters that demand he not be allowed in the Hall of Fame. Are you going to show the same outrage towards Barry Bonds who truly is a FAT ASS! And that fat ass did lie instead of avoid answering questions. He still lies and still refuses to come clean. I am all for keeping Mark out of the Hall of Fame or using an asterisk next to his name. But if we do then we have to do it for Bonds, Sosa and a few others.
A baseball player with a neck the size of a buick uses steroids!!
Next thing you'll tell me is that Sarah Palin works at Fox News
give it back to Maris and hit the road cheater!
just refuse to answer questions. Which as I recall is pretty much what he did. So there's no jail time for that.
As for it not helping him that's just crazy. I've always felt the real shame of the abuse was the taking away of careers of those who didn't use.
Oh, and you don't..?
Hate to say this, but a blog is technically a tool for PR whether it's intentional or not.
Not that I'm condoning him, of course..however the fact that you condemn a network for something you do every day is pathetic.
couldn't make it in the big leagues he started for the Royals in 85 and they won the World Series.
He led the team in home runs that year (36 - Royals single season record) even George Brett didn't slam out that many that year.
and didn't have a big time career...
LOL . .
This is a very political story! Home town STL boy jhunter despises the "win at all cost" mentality of pro sports and this shows how greed and hubris turn good men into vile drug infected animals.
LaRussa is a good guy when he isn't driving impaired.
ESPN by definition is corrupt because they treat pro sports like it is some kind of virtuous endeavorer populated by altruistic saints.
Look carefully at these manufactured heroes and the racist exploitive game they call the "American Pass time".
Look at the media companies and owners that pressure for results, results, results. AT ANY COST!
What was the story about refs in the NBA not fouling out "stars"?
Look at the life expectancy of pro athletes compared to normal Americans!
Look who profits from these "games" THE SAME MEDIA COMPANIES THAT PROMOTES WAR, RACISM, SEXISM AND EVERYTHING WE AS PROGRESSIVES ARE FIGHTING AGAINST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Who in the hell is he trying to shit but himself saying that some years he used them and others he did not.
John you are correct on this.
.
we should be able to put anything or anyone, of legal and consenting age, in our bodies.
it would be nice to have personal freedom instead of corporate freedom.
The reason the Giants are not doing this with Bonds is simple. Everyone hates Bonds. He's a complete a-hole. Nobody likes him.
McGwire is the opposite.
is in way deeper than Mac.
His BALCO ties and Grand Jury lies are worthy of the scrutiny.
Game of Shadows
I've been defending him this entire time. That being said, he only used performance enhancing drugs; he didn't murder anyone.
He lied to congress
The drugs are illegal
He broke rules and contracts
he is criminally and civilly liable
He was and is a role model for kids and young players
He is killing himself like Lyle Alzado
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyle_Alzado
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITG-IbHEYEE&fe...
So just so I understand...getting caught gambling (but not cheating) on baseball gets you a lifetime ban and no Hall of Fame.
Getting caught cheating with steroids gets you a network acting as PR firm, an aw shucks and not much else all because he filled seats. Lesson to all future players? Just cheat better, make sure you become famous in the process and all is forgiven.
Baseball needs to make an example ASAP. They continue to do so with Pete Rose so now they must follow their own precedent. Strip him of his records and prevent him from being up for a Hall of Fame, at least for his own lifetime.
And please none of this "it didn't make a difference" excuse. Power (which steroids effect) is very much a part of why a ball goes far enough to be a home run. That extra steroid enhanced strength sent balls those few extra feet.
Then why the fuck would he take them in the first place? -to help turn him into a base-stealing threat? To raise his bating average?!?
He made it to the majors and was signed by the Card's as a Home Run Hitter.
Once a liar, always a liar.
"Just because you got the monkey off your back doesn't mean the circus has left town" -George Carlin
He's nothing more than the nice guy version of Dave Kingman (who was such an asshole that he made Barry Bonds look civilized).
At least Bonds never pretended to be anything other than a complete assclown.
Nevertheless, all the roid junkies who've got the numbers should eventually get in the HOF. Remember, pitchers were exploiting the loopholes too.
Although Babe Ruth was the greatest player ever (until Bonds wins a few games on the bump... 'nuff said)... he never had to face the asskickers of the Negro Leagues.
Additionally, the players of Mays, Aaron, et. al were routinely partaking in illegal stimulants (uppers and downers) on a regualar basis. Plus, the mound was 5" higher until 1969, and pitching specialization was yet an afterthought, not to be discovered until the 1990's.
It ain't all apples and apples.
Bonds, asshole. Clemens, asshole. Schilling, asshole/hypocrite. McGwire, dumbass/hypocrite. Raffy, dumbass.
Still HOFers.
BTW, time to let Shoeless Joe and that wretched piece of shit, Pete Rose, in too.
It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Great Guys -- Ty Cobb anyone?
Btw, you claim that Ruth is the best player ever(playing in a watered down league).
They're amphetamines. Major League clubhouses had them out in bowls like candy dishes in the 60s and 70s. EVERYONE was taking them.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
You an idiot!
Love how you commentors come long after the fight is over.
None of the players from Negro Leagues ever had to face the asskickers of the Major Leagues- regularly*- either. Satchel Paige was certainly one of the greatest pitchers ever, but Walter Johnson was no slouch. Bill Dickey and Mickey Cochrane might not have put up the power numbers of Josh Gibson, but they were outstanding catchers never the less. And on and on....
*Of course black and white players did face each other in the Cuban winter leagues and barnstorming tours.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
...his statistics will forever be tainted because he and his contemporaries FAILED to play against the best competition!!!
The African American athlete has been historically the most successful performers in this Nation's history...especially taking that percentage relating to opportunities that they were given. Imagine the NFL, NBA, Track and Field without them...that's what baseball was back then.
Baseball is the only sport that claims it's athletes from a hundred years ago while practicing sports apartheid are better than it's performers today...propagandized bullshit.
Until people can actually give the Negro Leaguers the same respect and statistical recognition given to the White Major Leaguers, your argument is a celebration and glorification of Jim Crow athletics.
Do the stats from the negro leagues exist in a reliable form?
I've read that the Negro League's owners didn't have the funds to hire statisticians for every game, so some performances couldn't be documented.
I maintain that the historic and disproportionate romanticizing of the white Major Leaguers doesn't stand up if one applied those same comparisons to today's athletes.
Right on John. I am glad you put this up. Crook and Liar... That is Mark McGuire. He cheated!!! He cheated to break the one year home run total record. Sammy Sosa did the same and so did Barry Bonds. Cheaters!!! All of them. There is no excuse for this turd. Sorry McGuire. You would be much more of a man if you returned the record (so to speak) and said you did not deserve it. Other than that you are a liar and a cheater!!!!!
I don't know if anyone saw the transcript of McGwire's interview with Costas but it may have been worse than we ever imagined -- yea, it turns out he was corking his steroids.
I actually acquired these before he hit his 62HR, thinking they might be valuable as he had hit 50 (or something in that vicinity) the year before '98. Donruss "Rated Rookie 87" card and the Topps card from 1987.
Before there was Barry Bonds there was Mark McGuire
Radix Omnium Malorum Avaritia
A 30/30, 300 hitter, multiple gold glove defense outfielder, numerous MVP awards well before the drug use, Bonds became jealous of the attention Sosa, McGwire, and others were getting all while the Major League Baseball powers that was happily went along counting the cash as fans returned to the game from the bitter strike years of 1994 and 95. Barry Bonds was neck and neck with Ken Griffey Jr. as baseball's best player for years.
Blinding hatred for Bonds by many fans and baseball people obscure these facts.
..sealed his fate in the eyes of fans. Cheating his way into the record books only confirms why so many people disliked the guy before he beat the Aaron and Maris/*McGuire HR records. He was an arrogant prick while a Pirate and actually got worse as a Giant
Radix Omnium Malorum Avaritia
didn't help him?
This is pure BS.
Steroids are designed to accelerate muscle mass growth.
They help muscles rebound faster from vigorous workouts and thus enable more vigorous workouts to take place more frequently.
Even just simple testosterone works magic when administered correctly and has the added benefit of assisting in the formation of more red blood cells.
More RBC, more O2 to the muscles, more speed and power in the contraction of the muscle.
I don't know what he was taking. He mentioned hGH, Human Growth Hormone.
That is simply one of the most amazing things to put into the human body for increased muscular performance.
And please let's not start on the hyperbole of the "dangers" of steroids. There is vast literature that is real science which shows that with proper administration and use, this type of drug is safe and effective for its intended purpose.
See www.steroidlaw.com
and read up on Dr. Norm Frost and the book Legal Muscle.
...but it is surely relevant to all aspects of our national life and another sign/symptom that our national psyche needs help.
"Greed is Good"...has been the mantra for many decades now, not just on Wall Street and not just for money, but for acclaim, power and control. People in all walks of life are willing to Lie, Cheat and Steal to 'get ahead', to achieve the 'American Dream', to have more than their neighbor...no matter the cost, no matter who gets hurt. Even to the point of using our sons and daughter to kill and be killed in foreign lands for no reasons but greed.
When politicians and fake Xians speak about 'American Values' these days, I laugh. We have no values, we have no integrity, we have no heroes anymore.
"Egotism is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of Stupidity" - Frank Leahy
because it wasn't against the rules to use steroids when he used them. Same with Bonds and Sosa and Clemons, et al. And think about this: no blacks could play in Babe Ruth's day. But blacks made up 12% of the population then; so one can assume that 12% of the best players weren't allowed to play. So Babe Ruth faced pitching that was diluted in quality by 12%. But does anyone ever say we should asterisk 12% of his home runs? And, surely, benefiting from racism is worse than steroid use. Babe Ruth also only faced American pitchers (another angle of racism in baseball that's never addressed), whereas hitters today face pitching talent drawn from a much wider pool. Allow blacks and Asians and Latinos into Ruth's game, and he hits maybe 614 home runs instead of 714. Maybe. Maybe as few as 550. But we can't say, can we, because that was the game in his day. Just as the game in McGuire's and Bonds' day didn't disallow steroids. Thems the breaks. You play the game with the rules that exist; if you don't like the rules, don't play the game or work to change them.
And take it from one who played the game (post-Latino & black inclusion, pre-Asian and steroid era): it don't matter how much steroids McGuire and Bonds shot into their asses, they couldn't have done what they did unless they were simply among the greats. It's a damn hard game, and steroids don't create the talent. Just ask those thousands of players who juiced and never made it.
The thing is that today they still claim that blacks only make up about 12% which I think its much more. Now that blacks and the rest of the rainbow now play in the majors. Are 12% of the best pro pitchers black? Nope! And if we are going to do these type of comparisons then there are some other things we must take into consideration. Read the book "The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs: Recrowning Baseball's Greatest Slugger"...
In this exhaustively researched examination of Babe Ruth's storied career, Jenkinson argues that the Bambino was the greatest slugger of all time, not Barry Bonds, not Sammy Sosa, not Hank Aaron, and not Roger Maris. To make his point, he approaches Ruth from three perspectives. First, he discusses and analyzes Ruth's historic batting power, relying on original newspaper accounts. Second, he examines Ruth's "hidden" career of about 800 exhibition games. Third, he does a degree-of-difficulty analysis between the various conditions (equipment, medical sophistication, and press scrutiny, among other factors) Ruth experienced and those of sluggers in other eras. For example, Ruth injured a knee early in his career, and it was a recurring problem. It would have been easily repaired with modern medicine. Current conventional sports wisdom holds modern athletes are bigger, faster, stronger, and therefore better. Here we have the carefully researched, imaginatively argued contrary position. Great reading for any baseball fan, but especially those whose passions are ignited by comparisons of players from different eras. And when you consider the larger playing fields and the number of outs that would have been homers in today's ball parks. Instead of reducing his home runs by 100 (who knows how you came up with that crap) we probably would have to add at least 200 or more home runs. So you can try using all that bull crap racial b.s. But if Ruth had played with today's sports medicine and smaller playing fields we would all be saying Henry who? And forget fat ass Bonds he is just as guilty as McGuire. The only difference is he still wants to lie about it!
I'm not going to disagree with you about Ruth being the greatest all time slugger, or that the other factors you mention factored in Ruth's performance (although I'll say that Ruth got the benefit of little scrutiny from the press), but I disagree that Ruth suffered from the dimensions of the old parks.
Take a look at the short right field foul lines at Ruth's two home parks in New York: 258' down the line at the Polo Grounds (although the power alley was considerably deep) and 295' at Yankee Stadium. Give Barry Bonds a home park with similar dimensions and he might never have felt the urge to 'roid up.
And while we're on the topic of ballparks and their dimensions, I've got to say that, imo, the most impressive power season I can think of was Hank Greenberg's in 1938. 58 homers for a right-handed hitter whose home park had a left field measurement of 340' to the foul pole. Then consider the distance to the left field pole in the other American League parks at the time:
*Boston: 310' (but with the Green Monster)
*Chicago: 363'
*Cleveland: 375' (League Park), 325' (Cleveland Stadium, where the Tribe only played on Sundays, holidays and a few selected "important" games)
*New York: 301' (but 415' to straightaway left field)
*Philadelphia: 334'
*St. Louis: 351'
Washington: 407' (Yes, over 400' to the foul pole!)
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
If the situations were reversed you'd question the validity of giving one group credit for being afraid to compete against another. Back in the Babe's time there was no NBA, the NFL was in it's infancy(baseball was only a bit older). BASEBALL WAS THE ONLY REAL TEAM GAME AVAILABLE. But not for Jim Crow baseball would have gotten the best and hungriest black players(BTW, Negro League Legend John Buck O'Neil said the Chicago American Giants in the 1920's suited up eight Ricky Henderson's in their lineup). As for your ridiculous suggestion concerning black pitchers, I relate that projection to the dilemma of the black quarterback ...a position historical considered a white man's domain by racist coaches who couldn't fathom giving such responsibility to a negro. Cannot ignore the residual effects of decisions by ignorant, influential people(research Cap Anson) Such pathetic stereotypes didn't exist in the Negro Leagues.
Sorry, no pass(fables, lies) here buddie.
Not every player in the Negro Leagues was an All Star. Josh Gibson didn't hit all of his HRs off of Satchell Paige. You throw those guys into the Major Leagues then, yes, it would have been more competitive...But everyone who was an All Star, white or black, would have seen their stats take a hit.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
I respect your knowledge Andy...we've debated before. I just feel that the feats of Cobb, Speaker, Hornsby, Paige, Papa Bell, Gibson should be told truthfully.
liable as it was illegal to possess and/or use steroids without a physician's prescription at the time of his use.
So yes, he was cheating by breaking the law.
For the love of god, save the manufactured outrage and crocodile tears for things that actually have an effect on human lives.
I love sports as a whole and baseball in particular. I know and love the history of the game and the great players who play and have played in generations past. With that said, sports is entertainment, nothing more. Baseball is not to be sanctified; it is to be watched and enjoyed.
Watching sports is no different than watching a film or listening to music. If you feel that any player has tainted the hallowed children's game because he took steroids or HGH or any other "performance enhancing drug" then take all of those great rock albums you own and throw them in the trash. Why? Because the artists who wrote and recorded those albums were all under the influence of "performance enhancing drugs." Yet, somehow, noone huffs and puffs in righteous indignation about how they desecrated the church of rock n' roll. This double standard is borderline retarded.
Perhaps we should be thanking these players for risking health and jailtime in order to revive baseball after the strike nearly crippled the game.
Also let's not lose sight of the fact that Mark McGwire is genuinely one of the nicest men to ever play the game. He has donated millions of dollars and countless hours to abused children, and continues to do so long after the end of his playing career.
And don't even start with the "athletes as role models" angle. If you subscribe to this theory then you're either a bad parent, the child of bad parents, or both.
*Remember the asterisk people were going to put beside the "home run records" of guys like Mark McGwire, Sosa and Barry Bonds?
I've got a better idea. Just pour ink on the page. Blot the whole damned thing out. What's the point of having records if they're broken by artificial means? Might as well let Sosa keep corking his bats. Might as well let pitchers launch balls with a cannon.
Look, we all know where this is really headed: In a handful of years, genetically enhanced athletes will emerge with ape-like strength and gazelle-like speed. Hell, the genes of apes and gazelles will make it happen. Point is, at what point will this chemistry-enhanced circus become nothing more than a battle between two-legged lab rats for biotech companies?
Lying assholes like Mark McGwire have already proved that normal humans can't compete with drug-enhanced Goliaths. Baseball used to be a source of genuine nostalgia; now it's a stale joke drained of all perceived significance. Nobody cares anymore how fast a pitcher throws a ball or how far an over-muscled goon hits a ball. Now they just want to know what kind of drugs they were pumping into their ass.
Even so, there is a simple way to solve the problem and save baseball from death by meaningless spectacle. Deaden the baseball. Take so much hop out of that sucker that even Babe Ruth with a running start couldn't hit one out. Make it fly like a sack of wet, rolled up socks.
Oh, the Yankees would hate it. Same with the Red Sox and all the other teams with juiced-up body builders posing as baseball players. Suddenly, they'd have to learn to RUN THE BASES again. Suddenly, little fast contact hitters with .360 averages would score more runs than guys with .280 averages that fly out to the warning track.
They won't do it, of course. Just as in tennis, modern equipment and chemistry have made the game a boring slug-fest. Wham, an ace. Wham, a home run. It's about as interesting as watching robots punch holes in sheet metal.
...the inside game! Small ball. Bunt singles, hit and run, double steal, 1-0 final scores! The Baltimore Chop!
But I'm afraid that there are only three of us- you, me and John McGraw- who want to see that again, and one of us is dead.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
It has to start somewhere. Even if we don't hold our politicians accountable, we should at least make our athletes own up. After all, kids don't grow up saying, "I want to be like Joe Lieberman when I grow up."
Screw the asterisks. Strip McGuire, Bonds, Sosa, A-Rod, and anybody else caught using steroids of ALL their stats. Kick 'em to the curb if they're active, and put a lifetime ban on them.
We've got a generation of kids that have grown up thinking it's OK to cheat, just don't get caught. That attitude becomes ingrained, and follows them long after they've hung up their cleats.
Once we clean up professional sports, maybe then we can work on Washington...
Baseball players pack 'roids because baseball fans expect to see home runs slammed over the outfield wall. Players will use them because that's what helps them do it.
It's the same reason fighting has not been banned in pro hockey. The fans (or some of them) expect to see fighting. The NHL stands to lose a lot of paid seats if fighting is banned.
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"I don't want to talk about my past," does NOT make for a strong argument in defense of one's "CLEAN" record, when said "record" is factored INTO the question, NO?
Q: "I don't know what you mean by, "I don't have that problem"."
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Starve the WAR Beast...
... Feed Americans.
Here's Jayson Stark's take.
Here's a taste:
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
Who cares?
Doesn't matter a hill of beans to me if they smoke crack in the dug-out.
Rush Limbaugh is what a smart person thinks a stupid bigot sounds like.
I'm sure my being a Kentuckian may color my views a little, but for real, screw Bob Knight. This windbag went on bemoaning the lack of integrity in college basketball, citing John Calipari being hired on as UK's coach. I'm sure it had nothing to do with professional jealousy from a has-been coach who hadn't been worth 2 drops of piss since 1987 worrying about a team that could be the first undefeated basketball team in the NCAA since...Bob Knight's Hoosiers in 1974, I think. His glowing endorsement of McGwire proves just how hypocritical Bob Knight is. Sorry, I had to get that off my chance. Seriously, screw Bob Knight.
is all you need to make everything better, again. I think the home run hitting record goes back to Roger Maris.
Also while this article may not be about politics, per se, it IS about politics in the truest sense. It's all about honesty. It's all about what we do in America to make it, which is, literally just about anything.
Sure, we could hold Mark McGwire accountable for rule-breaking that he has openly confessed to doing, but oughtn't we move forward and try to put this ugliness behind us by acting like it never happened.
Being held accountable for one's deeds is just something the little people have to deal with.
Mark McQuire is an example for us all. He's a great American. He reached the top of his profession by following the rules of all America's recent great successes. Lie, cheat, use any means possible, legal and illegal, to gain an edge.
And of course, when you get caught. Obfuscate so as to not incriminate yourself.
Then later, you can cut a deal to avoid prosecution and write a tell all best selling book (coming soon) that throws all your closest friends, opponents and teammates under the bus.
USA! USA! USA!
"Anyone that makes less than $150K in this country, has no business voting Republican."
So McGuire says this stuff didn't help him? Then why did he take them? Over and over and over and over and over.
that he took it to overcome injuries so I guess that's how he justifies it in his mind. But, if that's the logic he's using it's flawed because it essentially means he had an advantage with respect to recovery from injuries that non-cheaters didn't have, thereby allowing him to play more games in a season which then provided him with more opportunities to hit homers and break the record.
No hall of fame for these cheaters, ever.
Someone stated that Babe Ruth's stats were as suspect as McGwire's and maybe worse due to not allowing african american players in. I agree that it certainly would taint the results but Babe Ruth did not solely choose to allow the discrimination. McGwire chose to take the steroids.
http://espn.go.com/espn/apphoto/photo?sportId...
Look at this liar hug Roger Maris Jr……what a PHONY!!!
Pathetic.
Maris is the home run king. Period.
…put McGwire in the Hall Of Shame with the rest of the juiced up fakes.
LuLu
Once a liar, always a liar.
"Just because you got the monkey off your back doesn't mean the circus has left town" -George Carlin
...entertained??
"It's interesting the the Giants aren't trying to do the same for Barry Bonds."
It's funny that you mention this since, on reading your opening sentence where you said this isn't political, all I could think of was the treatment of Bonds. I remember it being fairly odd at the time that McGwire wasn't receiving the same treatment, despite playing the same game. And now? Bonds is still dealing with a criminal trial hanging over his head regarding obstruction, when McGwire did the exact same thing to Congress. He never invoked his 5th amendment rights. He simply refused to answer the questions. Why was McGwire spared all while there was a circus around Bonds that is still pending in court?
First, McGwire was always a big, muscular guy. Bonds became a big, muscular guy in the middle of his career. It was just so obvious that Bonds was juicing.
Second, Barry takes after his father: He's an asshole. Had he conducted himself less churlishly, paid attention to ballplayers he grew up around like Willie McCovey or his (Bonds') godfather, Willie Mays, or even McGwire- who was always at least blandly charming- Barry's ride would have been a lot less bumpy. And it's not that Barry was just an asshole to journalists, like, say, Ted Williams was. Barry wasn't liked much in the clubhouse (though his coaches and teammates all seem to have appreciated his talent, none of them seem to have anything good to say about him off the field), and he wasn't very friendly to fans, either.
Don't try to confuse the issue with half-truths and gorilla dust.
here's a couple of observations. McGwire's rookie card listed him at 6'5" & 220, while Bonds listed him as 6'1" & 185. Although McGwire was obviously taller, to look at their cards - they both had pretty much the same body type.
It's obvious both were juicing. McGwire was just plain huge (and I remember Sosa looking like linebacker too).
And as for Bonds, his teammates hated him in college too. There are so many storys about Bonds - and none of them are good.
In 2003, 104 MLB players failed drug tests for banned substances. Of those 104 names, only a small number of those players names have been leaked. What happens with the remaining anonymous players? Will they be able to play out their careers, possibly get inducted into the hall of fame?
You have 30 teams in the league, just by working out the average, that's 3.5 players per team that were juicing. That's plenty of room for a closing pitcher throwing over 100 miles an hour and a cleanup hitter putting 40+ hrs per season.
If they ban McGuire's induction into the hall of fame, when now he has admitted to the use of roids, where will be the justice if many of these anonymous players in turn get inducted? How many world series were won by teams with players who were juicing?
If you strike their statistical records from the books (which is fine), make sure you strike the pennants and world series from the record books also.
Personally, I never thought he was a great hitter.
I mean yeah, he could hit home runs, but a hitting coach needs to teach players how to hit for average also.
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