Britons Unite To Defend Their National Health Service
By Nicole Belle Sunday Aug 16, 2009 11:00am(h/t Mugsy)
I guess the UK is sick of hearing we namby-pamby Yanks brag on our health care system and trash theirs, disregarding the fact that the UK pays significantly less per capita for health care and achieves far better outcomes. And they've decided to push back:
Britons love to mock their National Health Service — just don't let anyone else poke fun at it.
They particularly resent the British universal health care system being used as a punching bag in the battle against President Barack Obama's proposed reforms.
Conservatives in the United States have relied on horror stories from Britain's system to warn Americans that Obama is trying to impose a socialized health care system that would give the government too much power.
In an interview widely interpreted here as an attack on the U.K., Republican Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa told a local radio station last week that "countries that have government-run health care" would not have given Sen. Edward Kennedy, who suffers from a brain tumor, the same standard of care as in the U.S. because he is too old.
The superheated debate broadened this week to include renowned physicist Stephen Hawking, a British icon who suffers from motor neurone disease. A U.S. newspaper wrote that under the British system Hawking would be allowed to die — an assertion that Hawking said was absurd.
"I wouldn't be here today if it were not for the NHS," Hawking said, joining the ranks of those praising Britain's system.
Britons say the country's universal health care system, which provides free medical care, is far fairer than the current American system.
Behind the criticism is a popular British view that American society represents unbridled capitalism run amok, with catastrophic results for people left behind in the boom times like those of the last two decades.
Business Secretary Peter Mandelson, who is usually pro-American, blasted U.S. health care Friday, suggesting the delivery system is fine for the wealthy but not for the poor.
"If you can't pay, you have a very, very second-rate service or you can't get health service at all," he said.
Britain's left-leaning government has responded to criticism offering selected statistics that show England out performing the U.S. in health spending per capita, life expectancy and more.
Newspapers have jumped in, with the Daily Mirror calling the United States "the land of the fee" because of the way patients are forced to pay for medical services.
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The story should be told that it was the very conservative Winston Churchill who set the British National Health system in motion.
Joe Conason here
In the British system the government owns and operates the entire program. It is a full national system, beyond the single payer system of Canada.
Once in place, it was very popular and no one dared dismantle it. Not even the Iron Lady.
And the whole world knows it.. We have become a nation of talkers and no longer know how to take action against dictatorial leaders and their criminal abuse..
We let then give our manufacturing plants and jobs overseas.
We let then lie and illegally start a war for oil , revenge for bush sr. , for a safety net for Israel , Saudi Arabia the home of 15 or the 19 terrorist and the Bushes partner in oil and high finance..
We let them illegally spy on us and data mine even our most personal information about our health , finances and everyday routine.
We let them destroy our constitution , bill of rights , democracy and our country.
We let them destroy our economy and steal our money WITH NOT EVEN an oversight so this Global Banking Empire could pay the criminal debts , give their ceo's millions in salaries and bonuses.. Then telling the home owners to go to h... and took their homes...
They have set up a two class system in this country one for the elite and Slave owners ,,,, and the others are the slaves and throw a ways when it comes to any part of sharing in this country's wealth or power...
We have become sheep and we wonder around bitching about these criminal and inhuman actions and policies doing nothing about it..
We have lose our backbone and any fight that we might have once had..
most of the people who frequent Crooks and Liars, and other 'left' or 'liberal' blogs are expending a lot of energy whinging about the "Repugs" and missing the fact that a significant number of citizens of this United States are fat (better than 80%), tied into dead-end jobs (almost ALL of us), and politically disenfranchised (wouldn't self-identify as either party--wish I knew this percentage). Because of our fatness, we have a plethora of disease and health challenges that are guaranteed to put mega-buckages into the pockets of the tiny fraction of our citizenry that owns/controls big pharma, and big insurance (not to mention all the pols who are wholly owned by these companies).
Why is anyone surprised that the tiny fraction of our citizenry, the Corporatists, want to keep lapping up the mega-buckages to which they've become addicted? That IS the way of capitalism, is it not? How can we embrace capitalism and argue with that point?!
BTW, I'm about to be among the first casualties of Obama's decision to cave to the Corporatists. I don't see how I can continue to exist in this country with no job, no health care, and no safety net whatsoever. Look for me on a warm street corner somewhere, begging for a wee bit of change so I can buy a meal (by the way, Malkin, I'd MUCH RATHER BE WORKING!!!!!!!)
I hate to see you mention Churchill as the architect for the NHS. In the UK more credit is given to ANEURIN BEVAN who was the minister for Health in postwar Britain, and also one of Churchill's fiercer critics. Please see his wikipedia page for more info.
"Bevan was born into a mining family in November 1897 in South Wales. At the age of 13 he worked in a colliery, but due to a health problem he was forced to leave. Eventually he entered politics, becoming Minister of Health in Attlee's Labour government in 1945."
"The collective principle asserts that... no society can legitimately call itself civilised if a sick person is denied medical aid because of lack of means." —Aneurin Bevan, In Place of Fear, p100
Under Thatcher's tenure the NHS was not at its best; massive increase in demand meant they had to increase the budget but in the 80's NHS hospitals were 'perceived' to be much like British Rail; slow and a bit grim. Using this perception, common regarding government run services at the time, Thatcher's principal has always been privatisation and the NHS was no exception. Other national services she privatised were British Rail and British Telecom, but they couldn't really touch the NHS at the time. But the tories always agitated for an increase in the 'market mechanism' regarding private corperate involvment with the NHS. Much of this was implemented under subsequent governments both Conservative and Labour. Many of these policies led to problems with hospital staffing, dentistry, cleanliness, waiting times, 'foundation' hospitals, massive private consultancy fees, an obsession with bloated databasing over practice, etc.
But even with its problems its still better than a purely insurance led system as in the US.
Thanks for posting my vid, though a hattip would of been nice. :)
I apologize. John sent me the URL via Iphone while at Netroots.
I'll give you a hat tip right now.
I wish YouTube would allow its users to change their username like they did in the "old" days (probably caused havok).
I created my account with the "BI30" username when my blog was still "The Bush In 30 Seconds Archive", which I changed once Bush was out of office. I've considered creating a new account, but BI30 has well over 300 subscribers. :)
I am one, though I won't tell you which one.
OBTW
Thank you!
I'm glad you dug that up.
The Repugs can't be allowed to go unchecked. We already know what they're capable of.
Thanks bud.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0DK1dl8eRc
Sun, 08/16/2009 - 12:07 — Mugsy
Thanks for posting my vid, though a hattip would of been nice. :)
__________________________________________________________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf1xmUOB7Sk
No Shit !
My parents just recently moved back to Scotland.
My dad had a heart attack. Boom, right into the hospital. Charge? Nada.
Two weeks. Not a cent.
Then , he had to go back in because one of his lungs started filling up with fluid. Charge for three weeks? Nada.
The Dr's visit him at home twice a week. The nurses visit him at home 3 times a week. Charge? Nada.
They are also entitled to, 450 pounds(Roughly 600.US) for a rent subside, 600 pounds disability for my dad and another 450 pounds for my mom. Both of my parents are disabled now. That's on top of the pensions from both the US and the UK. They are also entitled to 85 pounds for energy. But that's only through the winter. There's more, I just can't remember them right now. I'm still very pissed off at this news of no public option.
So he gets 165 pounds a week to look after them.
They also cover Dental and Vision on the National Health Service.
From what I've seen, Theirs puts this one to shame.
ALL of there Rx's are free as well.
Actually Rx is originally the astrological sign for retrograde:
http://www.north-node.com/astrology-tutorials...
for taking care of the elderly!!! And, all of the other citizens, too.
The elderly are expendable. This country doesn't believe in fix it. Here, it's replace it.
In Mexico, it's amazing. They fix everything. They have too. They're for the most part poor. But I'm not very informed on their health care system. I know they have to pay into it to get benefits. The problem there is the amount of their people who are poor. If they haven't been able to work and pay into it. They're shit outta luck.
.
Thanks, that reminds me.
My parents are also entitled to a 2000 pound bereavement payout.
To help bury them when the die. That's 2000 pounds per person.
That's roughly 3000 dollars US,per person. Here? It's something like 275 dollars.
recently? How can the poor buinessman survive????
Hope your dad is doing better.
and being treated like human beings... well taken care of, as it should be. I'm appalled that the crappy medical system in the U.S. seems to be continuing at the very time it could be turned around. Time for the corporations to get their heads out of the medical butt, if you will. Insurance doesn't belong in medicine... not for one second. When someone is ill, they need care, not fear of bankruptcy or denial of care because of financial status. Seriously... it's time this greed was over.
The article that cited Stephen Hawking contained the following paragraph:
"People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn’t have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless."
Here's the link, though it has since been scrubbed of that absurd paragraph:
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx...
You would think that before you very specifically hold a person up as an example of someone who would die under the health care system in question you would, you know, make sure that they didn't live in that country and rely on said healthcare system for their life.
The rank stupidity from the opposition to decent health care is truly amazing.
Because his electronic voice box doesn't have an English accent.
Yeah, I know. How fookin stupid is that?
Here in Texas within a few years of the fall of the Berlin Wall, during the early 90's, the Brownsville police department bought several former Stasi dogs, because they understood they were already trained.
But they couldn't get the dogs to do anything but lick themselves.
And then they realized the dogs only understood German.
So when they were pursuing criminals the officers noticed that they got an interesting effect from the pursuees, when they heard commands being yelled in German.
Is it just me, ysbaddaden, or is it growing increasingly more difficult to tolerate the conservative crap here in Texas?
A. Billo the Clown to put England on his "boycott" list as he did France and..
B. England respond by putting him on the same "not welcome here" list along with Michael Savage.
It has been a bit of a pleasant surprise how quickly and furiously Britain has reacted to the complete lies being told about our NHS. The regular person in the street feels outraged and attacked, especially when they hear that we have been compared with the Nazis by US media
MEP Daniel Hannan may not yet realise it, but I think his UK political career is over, though he seems to have a lot of job offers coming in from the Republicans, should he decide to emmigrate.
So long as nobody over here knew who the heck he was, he could get away with it, but now videos such as this are everywhere in the UK, he's done. http://www.arksark.org/blog/2009/08/14/mep-da...
Yesterday.last night I heard some right wing jerk say that Briton has a better mortality rate becasue they have a different life style hten we do and they have less accidents (He said that!!). I can't remember who but it will come to me and I will report back. I think it was somebody on Fox. Maybe somebody on Geraldo Rivera.
He might have been talking about the "lifestyle" difference that doesn't leave loaded guns lying around, or the agencies that enforce proper controls over food additives and pollution.
For sure, the NHS is not the only aspect of the UK that helps improve our health and life expectancy, but it is certainly the main part of that.
if I get injured snow skiing or some other sport or even if someone shoots me I will get the healthcare I need, but if I get sick, I may not. Either way I will get a large bill in the mail for payment with or without insurance.
There's something in the grease the Brits use to deep fry their fish and chips that prolongs life.
opponents of single payer want to be certain that a government bureaucrat doesn't get between them and their doctor.......but, an INSURANCE company beaurocrat already does get between them and their doctor....will someone please explain how one is better than the other?
Because you pay taxes every year to keep one on a comfortable salary, while the other has a job that relies on generating the maximum profit from you via any means available.
So clearly the private option is the more efficient!
Also, we should privatize the highway department, because look at the horribly inefficient Interstate Highway system government bureaucracy has produced. I'd much rather have a private bureaucrat setting tolls on the freeway I use.
No, wait...
I think the British system is the way to go and probably will have to happen sooner or later in the United States. I must admit, I was a bit sceptical about the Obama plan at first but then I started to put the pieces together.
If you look at it, most Americans lost a large amount of thier overall wealth over the past several years. 401(k)s, savings, checking accounts were all drained. Those in their youth may still have opportunity to rebuild and may still be in good health to compensate. That differs though for the so called "baby boomer" generation. That generation which is one of the largest ever is just now entering into their later years of life where costly medical procedures and treaments typically tend to skyrocket due to the person's advanced age. Couple those costly treatments with people who do not have the means to pay for them or health coverage that does not pay cover it and the government has a huge problem on its hands.
Sure, you can leave the system as is and let the chips fall where they may but then again, we might just see a large portion of the elderly population on the streets because of it. If that occurs who would you rather cover your healthcare costs? A government run health care plan or the cold hearted American streets? Government health care isn't some "death panel". Its a safety net.
you will hear none of it on Faux.
"the land of the fee"
It used to be "of the free"
I forgot one other thing that has annoyed us.
Since the inception of the NHS, it has treated visitors to the UK in the same way as citizens. We spend a lot of money every year treating US tourists and migrant workers. That's as it should be, as good hosts.
The US does not reciprocate, and charges British visitors insane amounts of money if we are foolish enough to fall ill there. Honestly, we should find out how much we've spent on looking after US citizens, and send the Republican party a (symbolic) giant bill for it.
Have any Republican politicians ever been treated for free by the NHS? I don't suppose there is a way to find out.
you can check to see if any of the republicans that went on those lobbyist paid trips to St Andrews ever had to see a doc or visit the emergency room.
Gee... who woulda thunk it?
surrender monkeys in 3...2...
How dare furigners get furious when we trash their country in order to defend the indefensible racket we got going in ours? Don't they know we are the bestest, freest, Christianest nation or earth, and thus everybody else must bow down to our needs. If we have to trash them, in order to make our Jesus-care system look good, so be it. Remember, if we hadn't saved their asses in WWII they would be speaking German now. so they better take it and kiss our ass...
(end of wingnut mode on)
Get that girl to a plastic surgeon, STAT!
is that in both England and Canada the rich and poor get the same medical treatment. And it's fair and equal. Meanwhile, neocons are hoping to kill off the poor while the rich inherit the earth!
To be honest, rich people in the UK can still get private healthcare if they want it. The most popular one, provided as a perk by a lot of employers, is BUPA. http://www.bupa.co.uk/ It's a lot cheaper than in the US, because they have to compete.
Most folks, even the well-off, don't bother with private healthcare, unless they desperately want a treatment that has not been approved for the NHS on the basis of effectiveness, or want a private room with restaurant quality food. (NHS food is perfectly edible. Sort of like a good school dinner)
You won't see that mentioned on FOX, because it would stop rich people being driven crazy at the idea of having to stand in a queue with regular folks.
The rich will always have access to the best healthcare. What is most important is that everyone, regardless of income, has access to a decent (and ever-improving) level of healthcare.
... both Canada and the UK allow for supplementary insurance. Meaning that the rich still get better health care if they wish to pay for the upgrade.
What burns the GOP is that the poor may stop financing exclusively the system, that provides the rich with far better health care... and the rich will be forced to pay their share.
The top earners in this country, have reached such social stratus not just because they have earned their wealth. But because they have figured out how not to pay their fair share. Which is what distinguishes the American elite, with a lot of the wealthy strata in other industrialized societies.
In Canada the rich may be able to upgrade to a better room in hospital, but surgical procedures can't be upgraded. Everyone gets the best medical treatment possible. For instance, when I had brain surgery 9 years ago I was confident that my neurosurgeon was absolutely the best and that every procedure that was done was not inferior in any way, despite the fact that I am not at all rich. Funny thing: I ended up getting a room right in front of the main counter in the neurosurgery ward because I kept getting up and wandering into other patients rooms. I spent a month under the watchful eyes of those very patient nurses.
Always keep in mind that in the U S insurance companies have a trillion dollar reason to fight health care reform! There's plenty of reasons to pay off right wing zealots to read scripted diatribes against health care reform.
it's like a slap in the face. Not only do we have to deal with these idiots at town hall meetings, but we have to look like idiots around the world because of it. Sad they couldn't put the real story on BBC news -
"Racist Americans cause stir at town hall events nationwide"
I guess the sub would be -
"Insurance company lobbies caught fanning the flames of racism through outright lies"
Can we get some headlines like this? Please?
you can wrest control of the media out of the Corporatists' greedy, fat fingers.
I've no doubt that the GOP is working on plans to "liberate" the communist Brits in the Spring of 2013.
We're a great choice for an invasion. We provide free world-class healthcare to all!
Well isn't that what is inscribed on the Statue of Liberty's tablet that we gloryingly accepted and proudly display?
Since my maiden name was Downing and I'm 64 years old, maybe now should be the time for me and mine to return to the land of my ancester's birth place.
It would be nice if England, Canada, and France combined to do a worldwide campaign and expose the lies that the Republicans tell. And this is the way the Republicans treat our allies.
We can yell the truth all day, but if it doesn't get reported in US media, it isn't going to help you much.
Has the Outrage in Britain been properly reported in any US mainstream media? It has been leading the news in the UK for several days, but lets face it, a lot of Americans don't really care what foreigners think.
The number of deluded US wingers I have seen suggest that the British people are not "free", horrifies me.
Obama needs to fight and win at getting the public option passed. If he doesn't his presidency is over. He will be another Carter. And that's exactly what the GOP wants. That's what the insurers want. Obama hurt his own argument when he drew a comparison to the USPS. Moreover, the problem here is that the American people have been brainwashed by the media. Obama and the Democrats need to focus on getting the Democratic message out and changing the American mindset. Town hall meeting are not the way to do that. The Democrats need a TV channel to run against Fox. They should be focusing on that because converting the sheeple is the key to victory. If you think about these people are arguing against their own benefit!
I'm glad to see these stories finally getting at least some air play here in the U.S. I've seen some of the British news and read some of the British newspapers and these people are getting really upset, as they should be. The Town Hall lunatics are spreading the right wing talking point lies about the NHS, when in fact, these uninformed crazies hardly even know anything about health insurance in their own country.
BTW, most British conservatives would be considered liberal here in the USA.
Savage self-criticism is a national sport in the UK. All part of the culture of 'British Miserablism'. But with the NHS, most people in the UK (apart from the very wealthy or those Alf Garnett types who habitually vote against their own interests) would never wish to do away with it. They want to freshen up the baby's bathwater, not tip out the water and the child.
...and have nothing but good things to say about it.
I forgot one of my medicines while packing for a month-long trip through Great Britain, Whales, Scotland and Ireland. I went into a clinic in Ross-on-Wye. I explained I was on holiday from the US and needed to see a doctor to refill my prescription. I waited ~ 1/2 hour to be seen. Everyone was very courteous and professional. My medicine was not listed in their PDR, so the doctor called a number, and they looked-up the drug and found an equivalent. He gave me a prescription for a 2 months supply. I told him we would be near Ross for 3 more days. We agreed I would return the next afternoon for a deep-tissue massage. After that, I met with a chiropractor, who put the final touches on my treatment. The entire treatments were completed with a minimum of wait time.
I went to the surgery's main counter, on my way out, to pay my bill. The lady laughed and told me there was no charge. I explained I was a US citizen, but she said, everyone is covered here, even tourists. I was in shock. I went to the chemist and they filled my prescription at at very little cost to me (I am pretty sure it was < £5). I cannot tell you how impressed I was with the whole experience. I remember remarking to my wife, "Why can't we have a system like this at home?" We both knew the answer; GREED.
I pretty much despise our health system. The congressional thieves, unprincipled lobbyists, and the health industry in general, is ripping us off in plain daylight. I am suffering (dying) from end-stage liver failure (a parting gift for serving 30 months in Vietnam). I have seen the good, and the bad of our current system. The health care doctors and nurses I give high marks to. Insurance ..... works great if you do not care about maintaining you savings, or needing to take a mortgage out on your home, to pay for a ~$100,000 transplant.
I appreciate you sharing your Scotland medical encounter with everyone. It's a great indicator of people who actually care for people... not just say the words and do what they can to screw someone around just for money.
I'm very saddened by your outcome (liver failure). It's heartbreaking to know that not only are you leaving your loved ones, but have to incur debts in doing so. For me, I think that's one of the cruelest things... your family and friends who love you have enough emotional anguish with your passing that having to deal with the financial fallout is simply too cruel to consider. I wish you well in your remaining days... Peace and love!
Are advised to buy health insurance while visiting the U.S. My friends who stop over always tell me the premium price is "shocking" until I remind them how much an ER visit is...
My husband (a Briton) went home a few years ago and fell ill with food poisoning whilst on a train between the Midlands and London. Once in London he went to a clinic where he was treated and given some antibiotics. The total cost: about $7.00 for the pills. That was it.
Now we are both unemployed, having to take our children off our COBRA plan because we couldn't afford it and putting them on SCHIP. If it weren't for the COBRA gov't subsidy, he and I would not have any coverage (we have some pre-existing conditions). This situation would NEVER happen in the UK or Europe. We have dreams of moving back there if the situation in this country doesn't improve.
The insurance is for people who are traveling out of the UK. It is sold by UK companies specifically to people going to the US and other places where the healthcare is not so generous to strangers/non-citizens as that in the UK. I did not intend to mean that UK travelers have to buy insurance from US plans.
I gave birth to two children in hospital in Australia and never paid a cent. Stayed for a full week in a private room with the second one... not one cent.
I have no fears of falling ill in this country, although there are some terrible stories that do happen as the hospitals do need more staff - I'd say that's the case just about everywhere - but I don't fear bankruptcy if I get sick.
The American health care system is a scandalous money pit and the good folks are being rorted big time.
I, too, am Australian and agree with you. My wife has had 3 children and our families have all spent time in hospital for various problems and it's been all covered. I can't even believe that the USA is polarized over this tbh.
an American and having two children, the first I can't actually remember what my cost was, my second was a c-section and spent 5 days in the hospital due to jaundice, the Dr kept my wife in there the entire time because he thought it best that the mother and baby were kept together(I was there also, it was a single room). Total cost to us after everything, including the biliblanket for home and 3 or 4 trips back to the hospital for tests. About a grand, I can't complain.
My wife had to have her gall bladder out, total cost to us, just under $400.
My son spent 3 days in the hospital with pneumonia induced asthma, with a bed next to him for us. Out of pocket expenses right around $400.
And all of them would of taken payments if I needed to. Which for my sons hospitalization I did, I paid $10 a week, and they were fine with that, and no interest.
How did this get into this discussion -- calling the British government, "left leaning"?
Truly nutty - not to mention irrelevant.
You clearly don't get it.
Compared to the right-wing in the US, the UK's conservative government appears to us as "left-leaning".
in the U.S. of A. it's polarized... either you're right or you're left-leaning... incredible, isn't it?!
on British health care.
http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/healt...
How many tea-baggers watch BBC??
I'm guessing, not that many.
Some of dose Brits need Dental Care.
all have govt. payed dental care. I asked a British/French friend of mine why you see so many bad teeth in Briton. His answer was, that the govt pays so little to the dentists for preventive care, they try to find something major to "fix", so they are all scared of going to the dentist. Lest they get unnecessary root canals or other oral surgery. Which is the only way dentists there can stay in business.
Nobody ever died because they didn't get their teeth whitened.
your teeth whitened would be an elective procedure, he was talking about basic preventative care, cleanings, x-rays, minor fillings etc.
I am from Belfast in British ruled Ireland and anyone who knows anything of the politics of this region will understand it when I state I,m not a proud British subject and seldom if ever defend the British state, but what I will say is that in my opinion the only truly great thing about Great Briton is the National Health Service.I am what you guys would call an ordinary working Joe and have suffered from Asthma for most of my life.Not once in my life have I paid for treatment. been refused treatment or indeed had to wait for treatment.I have travelled extensively in your wonderful country from NYC to Hicksville and in my travels I have met many ordinary working Joes with less than perfect health and no health insurance.It seems utterly unbelievable to me that any right thinking US citizen can not see that all the resistance to universal health care in your country is being organized by vested interests who have something to lose in this debate.The NHS is not totally perfect by any stretch of the imagination but its light years better than whats on offer in the US and something I would defend to my dying breath.The NHS took care of my father in his last days, there were no panels, no one had the right to deny him care and he was treated with the dignity and respect we all deserve.
If I had my way Mr Hannan would be either tried for treason or drummed from the country or both.Can you imagine what sort of reception a US Congressman or Senator would receive if he came to Europe and spoke this way about his country? remember the Pussycat Dolls brouhaha
I hate to see you mention Churchill as the architect for the NHS. In the UK more credit is given to ANEURIN BEVAN who was the minister for Health in postwar Britain, and also one of Churchill's fiercer critics. Please see his wikipedia page for more info.
"Bevan was born into a mining family in November 1897 in South Wales. At the age of 13 he worked in a colliery, but due to a health problem he was forced to leave. Eventually he entered politics, becoming Minister of Health in Attlee's Labour government in 1945."
"The collective principle asserts that... no society can legitimately call itself civilised if a sick person is denied medical aid because of lack of means." —Aneurin Bevan, In Place of Fear, p100
Under Thatcher's tenure the NHS was not at its best; massive increase in demand meant they had to increase the budget but in the 80's NHS hospitals were 'perceived' to be much like British Rail; slow and a bit grim. Using this perception, common regarding government run services at the time, Thatcher's principal has always been privatisation and the NHS was no exception. Other national services she privatised were British Rail and British Telecom, but they couldn't really touch the NHS at the time. But the tories always agitated for an increase in the 'market mechanism' regarding private corperate involvment with the NHS. Much of this was implemented under subsequent governments both Conservative and Labour. Many of these policies led to problems with hospital staffing, dentistry, cleanliness, waiting times, 'foundation' hospitals, massive private consultancy fees, an obsession with bloated databasing over practice, etc.
But even with its problems its still better than a purely insurance led system as in the US.
Its annoying to hear both side's of the arguments, as they both horribly miss the point. Thing is, Government is broke. It owes a ton of money, We need budget Surplus, not even budget, or a smaller deficit. While some people may fully believe the fear-mongering that republicans are putting out right now, we also need to be wary of spending as much as what we are. My main reason, as many rational people's main reason, against any more gov't benefits is that we can't afford anything more right now. Even though Obama claims this would be Neutral, money wise, due to extra taxes and the likes, that still misses the point- its spending money we don't have. Those taxes should go towards our debts, so america can own itself, as compared to the many other country's that currently own large portions of america's debt.
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