David Axelrod: When You Go Into The Details, People Support The Healthcare Bill
Jake Tapper on This Week interviews David Axelrod on the healthcare bill, pushing the right-wing narrative that people don't want this bill. Axelrod responds that when you push on into the details, the public supports the things this bill does:
TAPPER: David, pluralities, if not majorities of the American people do oppose this bill. Doesn't he have a point?
AXELROD: Well, first, let me note that Senator Brown comes from a state that has a health care plan that is similar to one that we are trying to enact here, and that people in his state are overwhelmingly in support of it. He voted for it and said he wouldn't repeal it. So we're just trying to give the rest of America the same opportunities that the people of Massachusetts have to get health insurance at a price they can afford.
This bill is important to the American people, Jake, and when you get underneath the numbers and you ask people, do you support giving people more leverage against insurance companies so that they -- if they have preexisting conditions, they can get coverage, so if they get sick, they don't get thrown off, so they don't have these huge premium increases of the sort we've just seen announced in states around the country, they say yes. When you say, do you want to give small businesses and people who don't have insurance through the job the chance to get insurance in a competitive marketplace where they can get it at a price they can afford and give them tax credits to help them do that, they say yes. And when you say, should we reduce the overall costs of the health care system over time, they say yes.
But that's the program. That's the plan. And it is important to the American people that we have the fortitude to go ahead against it, to leave the politics aside, to leave the partisanship aside, to resist the special interests and get the job done.
TAPPER: But according to polls, the American people do not agree with what you think--
AXELROD: The polls are split, Jake. I mean, one of the interesting things that has happened in the last four or five weeks is that if you look at -- if you average together the public polls, what you find is that the American people are split on the top line, do you support the plan? But again, when you go underneath, they support the elements of the plan. When you ask them, does the health care system need reform, three quarters of them say yes. When you ask them, do you want Congress to move forward and deal with this issue, three quarters of them say yes. So we're not going to walk away from this issue.
as much as I do? I wouldn't trust him within 100 feet of me. Talk about a potion seller/snake oil salesman. According to David (on just about everything) if we just educated ourselves a little bit more we'd agree what a fantastic job the president is doing. It's just we, the uneducated voter, don't understand.
I thought they were the regressives. First we complain about the lack of left on these talk shows then we critisize the ones that do come on. What a bunch of mixed up progressive liberal democrats and independants we are.
I'm right there with you, Ron.
Say what you mean. Mean what you say. But don't say it mean.
3-2-1.............
I had burgundy last night, does that count?
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
a whiner. I don't like anyone lying to me and it doesn't matter who it is. And Axelrod seems just a little too slimy for me.
But hey, that's just my impression.
The way I see it you're in good company ..
With ..
Those Whining American Revolutionaries ..
Those Whining Abolitionists ..
Those Whining Suffragettes ..
Those Whining Civil Rights Workers ..
All those Whining Feminists ..
And the whining Gays, Lesbians and Transgendereds ..
Who refused to roll over and accept the status quo ..
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
.
Work it brotha!
attributing their own worst traits to those that oppose them, the liberals. They study from the Rovian playbook. As examples -
Liberals are the 'whiners', not the DLC'ers, who just can't seem to get anything done. It's always someone else who is holding them back - those 'retarded' progressives, Blue Dogs, Republicans, etc.
Liberals are the 'teabaggers', not the DLC'ers, who are enacting or keeping intact rightwing policies in virtually realm, from healthcare 'reform' to finance 'reform' to regressive taxation to wars to illegal rendition, you name it.
DLC smearing liberals.
On the European hour on NPR yesterday, the moderator said Obama's healthcare bill was 'very rightwing' and that no European would find it acceptable. Europeans, who have not been brainwashed by a corporate media and the relentless propaganda of the Rovians and the DLC'ers, still know left from right, and top from bottom.
They also believe healthcare is a right, not a privilege.
But apparently we still think we know better.
can allow for PROFITS!!!!
All the industrialized nations that have various plans that produce Universal Coverage demand that any insurers that are involved in the systems be NOT FOR PROFIT.
The fact that the DLC'er, Obama, is HAPPY with a plan that continues to involve the FOR-PROFIT HEALTH INSURANCE CORPORATIONS, should cause all of us to take pause and wonder....Why would Obama and the Democratic Party even CONSIDER any plan that will span over ten years, and that will be despotic in it's very nature??
The simple answer is because they are all tools of corporate America.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
Ron - outside of one Senator (Sanders) and a few Representatives (Kucinich, Grayson, maybe a couple more) there IS NO LEFT in American politics.
We're supposed to applaud getting the corporate shaft from Dems?
Why should we applaud it?
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
"Ron - outside of one Senator (Sanders) and a few Representatives (Kucinich, Grayson, maybe a couple more) there IS NO LEFT in American politics."
Damned straight!
is that there are a few democrats in the house and senate that block progress while it is 100% of the regressive republicans that block everything. I hate those democrats and LIEberman as much as you do but they aren't the majority of the party.
but still .. AxelRod is a slimey corporate whore ..
and in no way represents "the left" ..
that's my point!
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
he's not the one stopping progress. the Administration and the congress have both the regressives and the MSM's propaganda they are up against. They can't be disregarded.
President Obama IS the one stopping progress. Every time it appears there is traction for the public option, or even for just buying meds from Canada, it is the Administration that intervenes to kill it.
No, the propaganda and the obstructionists cannot be disregarded. But they can be FOUGHT if the political will is there. It's not.
The best way to defeat the INEVITABLE screaming on the other side is to FUCKING PASS SOMETHING THAT CAN BE FELT IMMEDIATELY. Once you do that, people aren't going to give it up without a serious fight. Like Social Security.
All major reform meets with obstruction and propaganda. Just review the Newstalgia site, and you'll see the same, tired, old arguments trotted out for Social Security and Medicare back in their day. Once passed, they're VERY hard to get rid of.
I do not relish saying this, but it is indeed President Obama who is the problem here.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
who's perpetuating the lies and the propaganda now. Just look at some of the comments on this site for an example.
Poor, poor Obama, he just can't get anything done because of the 'regressives' and the MSM propaganda. It's not Obama who is being regressive, it's someone else's fault!
It's not just a few Democrats. It's A LOT of them. I don't know if it's a majority of the party, but it's enough. And they keep drawing straws to see who gets to be the bad guy de jour. It's all a shell game.
If President Obama really wanted to stand up to corporate interests, he could have. It would not have been easy, but we gave him enough control of the Congress to get through just about anything he really wanted.
He uses the informal power of the presidency just like Lyndon Johnson did, only not to muscle around the supposed opposition. He only muscles around the progressives in Congress. Compromise compromise compromise.
If the Democrats actually delivered Health Care Reform, if it could be felt this year instead of in three years, the Democratic base, and so many other American people would be so energized for years to come.
And health care would command a similar sacrosanct reverence to Social Security. (Ever noticed how Republicans and corporate interests can't kill Social Security no matter how hard they try. We the people still have some power when we really care about our entitlements.)
The sad truth we have to face is that President Obama is not on our side on this one. And neither is the Democratic Party.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
.
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
The fact that a majority in congress call themselves Democrats does not mean they share the same values at all. Between the Stupaks and the Kucinichs it's a wonder they get anything done period.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
Oh, I agree with you on that, Peter. I don't think we disagree at all here. ;)
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
I didn't read the whole thread. I wouldn't place the blame entirely with the administration though. They didn't pick the cats but these are the ones they have to herd. For all the moaning about how Obama hasn't forced them to comply the fact is the president hasn't got much more than persuasion at his disposal and when he's forced to deal with so many legislators of firm principal and unwillingness to compromise this is what you get. It's not attemted bi-partisanship with the Republicans that is the problem it is the necessary bi-partisanship within the party that is.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
tooth and nail behind the scenes to kill meaningful reform and placate his corporate benefactors. To the public, he present a genial face and pretends like he's on the average American side. A corporate-owned media and relentless propaganda from the DLC'ers assists in the charade.
but no actual evidence.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
I present this entire year-long "health care insurance reform" debacle as evidence ..
(take that!)
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
could to make sure the public option wasn't included. What did he say "neither practical or realistic."
As opposed to single payer, which would accomplish all of their supposed goals?
Let's face facts -- if they wanted to "reform" the system, they would have. This is a dog and pony show to shore up votes now that the bankers and accountants blew up the country's economy (and took most of our retirement funds and a lot of our jobs with it).
There's a deepening divide between haves and have nots, and you can be sure that the insurance companies will make sure they're part of the former rather than the latter.
Do you want an honest answer or propaganda?
I just finished listening to an interview Ian Masters (KPFK Los Angeles) did with Jane Hamsher regarding this whole healthcare fiasco,
David Axelrod is nothing more than a waterboy for big Pharma, the For-Profit Healthcare Insurance Corporations, Big Hospitals etc. Anybody who stands to gouge the American People for their last dollar so they can make their Wall Street investors happy has Axelrod, Emanuel, Pelosi, Reid and yes, even BARACK OBAMA!!! doing their bidding.
Glenn Greenwald and Jane Hamsher are calling it out straight right now and besides Dennis Kucinich, they are just about the only ones who are.
Keep checking this website so when Ian puts up the interview from today with Hamsher you can listen to it. She has the inside skivvy of what's going down right now:
http://archive.kpfk.org/parchive/index.php
For one thing, it looks like Kucinich may be the final vote they need to pass this monster. Well, it seems the Senate DOES have the votes for a public option and so now Durbin has told Pelosi, "We'll pass the public option if you'll support it" and she said, "NO"!
So, Glenn Greenwald was right in his assessment that NONE OF THEM REALLY WANTED THE PUBLIC OPTION ALL ALONG, INCLUDING OBAMA!!!!
So, here we were, last summer, and the Progressive Caucus and MoveOn.org and lots of other progressives were saying, WE HAVE TO HAVE THE PUBLIC OPTION!
Well, here's Dennis Kucinich now saying, "I'll vote for the bill with a public option AND if the amendment is placed back into the bill saying that states who want to have Single Payer can do so WITHOUT THE THREAT OF LAWSUITS FROM INSURANCE COMPANIES.
And what is MoveOn.org doing to thank him for his PRINCIPLED DEMOCRATIC STAND??? (Especially considering that 85% of the American public SUPPORTS A PUBLIC OPTION!). THEY ARE DEMONSTRATING AGAINST HIM IN HIS HOME DISTRICT!!!!
Jane Hamsher is right. This whole mess has become like a surrealistic nightmare!
Would someone at Crooksandliars please take the lead on this and give your readers some straight freakin' information here about what is REALLY going down??
And one more thing. Axelrod is a big fat liar about how much the Mass Plan is loved in the Bay State.
Not true at all. People are hurting there under the plan with the penalties and PROFITS!!! They are having to continuously raise taxes to keep up and they are LOSING ENROLLEES EVERY MONTH!!
PLEASE read this post an activist friend of mine who is NOW LIVING UNDER THE MASS PLAN wrote at Real Politics: (Truth speaker with important info):
http://comments.realclearpolitics.com/read/42...
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
As usual you lay it out for all to see. I'll listen to that when it comes up and it's a crime what MoveOn is doing to Kucinich. Are they really?
I hope I get another chance to vote for him.
Moveon has been pimping this bill, probably because if it fails, Democrats are shot.
But they've been done as far as I've been concerned the second they put this painted turd on the table and wouldn't allow discussion on the one sane option they had (single payer, in case you're wondering).
Maybe we deserve years more of war-mongering, nature-destroying and upward motion of wealth. We seem to keep voting the fuckers in who push it, and when we don't, it's some milquetoast "politicians" who wouldn't know the "will of the people" if it bit them in the ass.
"It's the best we can do."
Will keep echoing in my ears.
Nice work, Abbywood. Thanks.
Corruption favors the wealthy.
!
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
but some of us posting on this very site have also been right all along and been trying to warn youse guys that Obama's number 1 priority was killing any semblance of a government-run plan, but alas, most refused or were unwilling to come to terms to what Obama is all about. Obama wants above all to let the insurance, hospital and pharmaceutical industries continue to maximize their profits on the backs of the American citizen.
It was pretty clear as far back as August if you got the gist of this NY Times article - Obama Is Taking an Active Role in Talks on Health Care Plan. Plus there have been numerous other sources leading to the inescapable conclusion. See, for example
Direct some anger at Max Baucus toward the president.
Public Option Success Is Close - But White House Pushes for Snowe's Trigger Instead. Say What?
Who's Killing the Public Option? President Obama With a Rahm-Bow
Lies and relentless propaganda.
says categorically that none of them wanted a public option that is called an opinion. It is not the same thing as a fact.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
I can't believe the interviewer did not choke when Axelrod said Massachusetts likes their plan. It is not working there and he should have been called out for trying to lie about it.
YES! YES! YES!
Thank you Rich.
Axelrod is the primary reason I was not an Obama supporter.
I have read that they met in 80s, so I think Axelrod sent Obama to Harvard. Because Obama was being groomed, there are no writings or statements from the editor of law review. No stance on anything, at all.
And if people would just educate themselves about Axelrod, they would understand why Obama is doing what he is doing.
I pledge allegiance to the Constitution of the United States of America, and to the republic which it established, one nation from many peoples, promising liberty and justice for all
I just hate people who are obviously lying talking down to me. That seems to be a specialty of Axelrod.
"When you ask them, do you want Congress to move forward and deal with this issue, three quarters of them say yes."
The people want real reform. Make it single payer and quit the dance contortions of corporate deal making to get something so watered down and counterproductive that it only resembles reform by using that word in its title.
It's pretty exclusive.
The funny thing is I saw on Michael Moore's website a couple of years ago polls that show the majority of American do not support liberalism, but when you list the issues they're for them.
Diabolus est Deus Inversus
the breakdown of polls years ago in another far far away land?
On Washington Journal this morning on c-span, the guests were talking about how you can make a poll say anything you want it to by just the way the questions are asked and the order in which they are asked. But for the most part, I think Axelrod is correct. When people take the time to read and listen to the plan they find things in it they like very much. If it were as awful as the repubs would want us to believe, why wouldn't they want it to pass and let the noose slide tightly around the dems throat? I think they are afraid it will pass, people will like it and those same people will remember it was the repubs who tried so hard to keep it from them.
Say what you mean. Mean what you say. But don't say it mean.
still leaves aprox. 15m uninsured. I don't think that was the initial plan.
Most could not even tell you what a liberal is , they just know it's a bad thing .
I agree with MICHAEL MOORE:
This bill it's a TRAVESTY:
""... we're just supposed to accept, well, you know, it's better than nothing. Is that who we are as Americans? ... This [health care] bill right now ... it's a travesty as far as I'm concerned." – Michael Moore"
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/mike-in-the...
Video
People Support The Healthcare Billsad sacks, known as 'citizens' and 'voters' and someone's 'constituency' realise what a steaming pile it is and are ready for some kind of insurrection.FIFY, and just sayin.
me-oww!
We're far too passive as a people to do the whole "insurrection" thing, just as long as the "haves" throw the "have-nots" a few crumbs now and then.
And things like "private health insurance" makes perfect sense until you actually need it for something, at which point it fails in an epic manner.
Just sit back and watch as "popular opinion" on this crap presides over a large upward movement of weath at an ever increasing speed. We're probably the only remaining democracy to still have an insane system of not taking care of ourselves.
I guess we get what we deserve... Someone keeps voting these assholes into office. :(
"When you ask them, does the health care system need reform, three quarters of them say yes. When you ask them, do you want Congress to move forward and deal with this issue, three quarters of them say yes."
none of which has got to do ANYTHING with the current bill...
When asked "Would you rather bring the troops home from Iraq and Afghanistan and cut the military budget by 60% in order to provide healthcare and education for all americans - 98% said yes."
Never mind, I'm just dreaming.
But it's never phrased that way.
It's always phrased as "do you want to let terrorists bomb your children and rape your mother? if not, sign at the blank on the bottom of the check", and "poor people don't deserve an education because they're life's losers."
Fucking conservatives.
.
about 5% would be screaming about not helping 'illegals' in a manner that would make them sound as if they were 6%, and that would stop the Democrats in their tracks.
me-oww!
That's another thing that burns me.
If you go to England, they treat you whether you're a citizen or not, and I'm pretty sure it's similar elsewhere.
So where did this "every man for himself" bullshit come from in "one nation under God"? I though we were supposed to look after each other, as far as all of the western religions that aren't complete batshit hokey pseudo-religions go...
pretty much the entire E.U. will care for you whether you a citizen or not.
It started with Ronnie "rotten brain" Reagan.
Rush Limbaugh is what a smart person thinks a stupid bigot sounds like.
when money becomes your god.
It's true that most people are against the bill, and it's true that most people don't know what's really in it.
The media couldn't care less about why different groups are against the bill. The media just likes poll numbers that say Americans at large are against it so it can spin the narrative into "Americans don't want health care reform."
My position: There are a lot of good things in this bill, but I am not convinced that they outweigh the bad. I am not convinced this will not make a very bad problem worse. I am ready to be convinced if the evidence is offered up.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
(Post written by an activist friend of mine in Mass. who has studied the bill inside and out with folks like Trudy Lieberman from The Columbia Journalism Review). Look for the post written by "truth speaker with important info."
Also, here is their website regarding The Mass Plan:
www.masshealthlawtruth.org
http://comments.realclearpolitics.com/read/42...
"The US has an army of 90,000 soldiers in Afghanistan and is spending $100bn a year, but has still been unable to defeat 20,000-25,000 Taliban who receive no pay at all." - Patrick Cockburn
I work in MA (but don't live there), and I can attest to the utter crapulence of the Mitt-Romney-style health insurance system they've got there.
The only people who like it are those who don't have to rely on it.
My opinion based on twenty years of operating a business leads me to believe that this is the beginning of the end of the insurance companies as the primary barrier to health care. I posted the reasons last night on Perr's thread.
Hasa Diga Eebowai
I'll check out your arguments.
Everyone is equally entitled to the pursuit of happiness. Wasn't that once self evident?
~
Corruption favors the wealthy.
"The American people like the details of the plan so it just doesn't make sense that they don't like the plan."
Consider:
You like the shirt; it's one of your favorites.
And the pants.
And the shoes, the socks, the hat.
So .. you like all the details.
BUT ..
(1) do they go together as an outfit?
-- not necessarily: the plaid pants clash with the Hawaiian shirt.
(2) do they make a complete outfit?
-- NO! There's no belt to hold up the pants!!
So ..
It is altogether possible to like all the details but not like the complete package.
And it's intellectually dishonest to try to sell this Bill using logically faulty arguments.
Therefore Axelrod is a slimey snake oil salesman.
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
I remember back when Bush came into power (the second Bush), we kvetched that all of his goons were the same old Reagan, and even Nixon, goons.
Now everything I didn't like about the Clinton presidency is back in spades, along with everything I didn't like about the financial industry.
As an aside ...
Obama is basically flushing his presidency down the toilet by tying it to milquetoast legislation that won't do a damn thing, pissing both his base off for not going far enough, and the utter lunatics for his audacity to breathe the air in the White House.
If you're going to flush your presidency away, why not do it in a way that has you remembered as a great president, like FDR for the New Deal ? Or JFK/LBJ for the Civil Rights Act? Make a difference, for crying out loud.
Whether this bill passes or fails, immediately push Grayson's Public Option Act.
Democracy is too important to be entrusted to politicians.
Rise Up!
Protest!
Uh Uh then why the uh uh hell did you uh uh uh never go into the uh details
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