Ingraham's wingnut guest starts spinning out '24' fantasies about the First Daughters
By David Neiwert Saturday May 02, 2009 12:00pm
Laura Ingraham, subbing for Bill O'Reilly last night on Fox, decided to bounce off reportage of the second-guessing now coming from ex-CIA chief Porter Goss, who's claiming that Obama's release of the torture memos had demoralized the agency.
So she invited on a couple of "experts," who start out by giving us the amusing prospect of Fox pundits complaining about TV-crew ambush tactics when conducted by ABC. (They may have a point, but hearing it on Fox is rich.)
One of the "experts," a New York City detective/tough guy named Bo Dietl, argues that the Obama administration's decision to eschew torture will come back and haunt them thus:
Dietl: What would happen, God forbid, if your two daughters were kidnapped by Al Qaeda, and they said they were going to do something, and we had information from people, where they were. Mister Obama, what would you like me to do? You don't want me to interrogate anybody?
Eh, sure, Bo, you can interrogate anyone you need to. But torture?
Of course, this all sounds like a lot of Jack Bauer fantasizing. Though you get a sickly feeling, watching Dietz, that torturing detainees might not just be a fantasy for him.
And why, exactly, does anyone consider Porter Goss a credible critic of the release of the memos?
After all, Goss is himself potentially one of the people who might be targeted for investigation, since he was CIA director for many of those years, was involved in the destruction of the torture tapes. He also is well remembered for having appointed Dusty Foggo to the CIA's No. 3 position -- before he was convicted of fraud and sent up the river.
Talk about the criminalization of politics. As I say, it is indeed a problem -- and the solution is to get the criminals out of politics.
Login or Register to post comments.
Is as smart as a steaming pile of horse shit.
No offense to steaming piles.
That's all I have to say.
cya
Torture for Profit is the American way.
I’m tense and nervous and I... can’t relax.
I can’t sleep, cause my bed’s on fire.
Don’t touch me I’m a real live wire.
'Cause tragedy thrills me
Whatever flavor it happens to be, like...
"Killed by the husband"
"Drowned by the ocean"
"Shot by his own son"
"She used a poison in his tea...kissed him goodbye"
That's my kind of story
It's no fun 'til someone dies
Why don't you watch where you're wandering?
Why don't you watch where you're stumbling?
You're wading knee deep and going in.
And you may never come back again.
This bog is thick and easy to get lost in
Cause you're a stupid, beligerant fucker.
This bog is thick and easy to get lost in
Cause you're a dumb ass, beligerant fucker.
I hope it sucks you down.
Wander in and wandering.
Noone even invited you in.
But still you stumble in stumbling.
So suffocate
or get out while you can.
Oh yes, Noone told you to come.
I hope it sucks you down.
against its "detainees." It doesn't lead to justice, but the cops who inflict it enjoy it. I don't think Bushco's reasoning was any better.
I thought Bo Dietl was only in the movies!?!?!
But there he is for real, in the flesh.
He is exactly like in his movies though.
Haven't seen Bo Derrick in quite some time.
She's really let herself go over the years, hasn't she?
Say what you will, but Bo Diddley rocks!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHs6f0mlkaM&fe...
Seldom mentioned in these discussions of "enhanced interrogation techniques" (aka torture) is how frequently these and other forms of cruel, degrading and inhuman treatment are used in America's jails, prisons, and other detention centers.
It's not surprising for a nation accustomed to this mistreatment of her own people to endorse such practices against foreigners.
My first response to all these torture-defenders is always:
"If you're relying upon your suspect for your intel, you've already failed."
The "Military Channel" is not a porn channel
You are not supposed to get off watching "The Passion of the Christ."
"24" is just but a TeeVee show, not reality.
And "1984" was a dystopian novel, not an instructions manual.
Now carry on and remain calm you insecure impotent dolts...
Call me a pig but I like the military channel. But I know what you mean about them treatign like porn.
I loved watching them talk about about the apache helicopter and how much stuff it could destroy, then they go "This is an extremely productive piece of machinery" Productive? ok if you say so.
You got to admit though, our military is pretty damn awesome. There is that 14 year old boy in me that loves that shit, but then there is the adult reasoning half of the brain.
..its how the CinC uses the military. Consider how many members of the military would still be alive and/or in one piece if W didn't invade Iraq based on lies and innuendo. Consider how many members of the military would still be alive and/or in one piece if we fought the war in Afghanistan with a real purpose other than putting someone sympathetic in power so oil pipelines could be run.
Our military is all about strong defense since we are not suppose to support an "invasion" doctrine. They are the tip of the spear and not the hand that wields it. Yes, we pay for some pretty cool stuff and we need soldiers to employ that "pretty cool stuff" to defend our nation not be told to attack sovereign nations who do not pose a threat to us.
Atlas Shrugged is a NOVEL!
From the Rude Pundit:
Now, in the National Review Online (motto: "Is anyone still reading this shit beyond bloggers who need something to argue with?"), Gallagher writes, "I personally believe torture is wrong. We shouldn't do it. Even if it means me, my husband, and my two sons get blown up. Seriously, if I had to choose I'd say: Death is common to us all; torture is a choice." It's as impassioned an anti-torture statement as anyone on the Left has made.
Now Al-Qaeda is being said to be coming in our country and kipnapping our children, including the President's. Also the word "interrogation" is being equated with the word "torture". Fear AND changing the meaning of words in one stroke! This man has a future in whatever the Goopers eventually turn into.
New UN Report Shows the US Combo of Torture and Impunity Thrives in Iraqi Prisons
More at link.
And throw away ANY hope of pressuring Saudi Arabia, Israel, China, Iran, or any of the other serious Human Rights abusers.
Sorry mr. bush and mr cheney, but i doubt even full discloser will save you now...
The only way America can hope to sanctify its actions is by having other nations act more horridly.
.
.
.
When a human being is tortured by one of the most heinous forms of torture that exists...
ONE HUNDRED AND EIGHTY-THREE TIMES...
That is no longer only torture. It is SADISM.
.
.
.
oh no!! only nazis and communists torture. and now we do too?
Ya, and remember what happened to the nazis and communists.
That 183 times, was 183 "pours" lasting a couple of seconds each, over I think 5 sessions. And if you think that is one of the most heinous forms of torture that exists..... I could think of quite a few that blow that out of the water(pun intended)
Ah it doesn't matter how long. The US in fact executed people who did that to American soldiers and civilians of other countries. It's been defined as torture for centuries. Also here is thing regular interogation in which they treated nicely provided far faster intel then straight questioning. All torture did was convince them to not tell anything or they started to babble gibberish in order to try to stop the torture or causes the torturers to act on the claims and not look at real terrorist plots.
It never got credible info. That claims it provided credible info was debunked. For a long time torture was said to not provide credible info. This BO guy is a misinformed Fox viewer.
Wow! Thanks for clarifying that. Put that way I guess waterboarding ain't all that bad. Heck, let's all start waterboarding each other, could turn into a national fad. Put it on TV. It'd be better than Wrasslin', you know. Why not let boy scouts earn merit badges in waterboarding? Then they could work their way up to more advanced forms of torture, like electro-shock, or toe smashing, or even that old favorite, bamboo shoots under the fingernails.
183 Pours? 5 sessions? Where did you come by that information? These are people that destroyed evidence. You believe anything these people have to say anymore? I've heard of your "faith based" thingy over there, but that's just rediculous.
I bet you are to big a coward to let me waterboard your sorry ass!
too big a coward to come try. Want my address? Well I won't give out my address but if you'd like, we could arrange a nice neutral place. As long as you give a notarized statement you are planning on torturing me.
And why do you think I'm a coward? Just because I make a correction?
ETA and what I find amusing is all the people who are so against it, offering to waterboard people they disagree with or call for it to be done to them. Or even solicit donations so someone will subject themselves to it.
people like you want to understate something like torture, is a sad torture on the rest of us.
a statement of being waterboarded 183 times to it being five sessions with 183 total 'pours' understating it? It is a correction of a overstatement. I'm sure if you check my posts you will not find one instance of me supporting or approving of this. I was simply pointing out a common mistake. If I were to say oh waterboarding isn't anything, its just getting splashed in the face with a little water. That would be understating it. Which I have never done. And btw I think your handle is very fitting for yourself.
But I only killed 5 people. Moral high ground-- I haz it.
a closer equivalent would be you saying you had sex 183 times last year. When the truth was you had sex 5 times with a total of 183 strokes.
But, but , but...what if aliens came down and took your daughters, Mr President? Would you torture one, if we caught one, I mean? Huh? I bet you'd do it then, wouldn't you?!
And these bed-wetters get on TV?
The FOX trolls are out in force repeating this guys talking points at the ABC torture twins comments thread.
If you're interested in some whack-a-troll there's an endless supply and they appear to be taking over.
What happened? Was Anne Coltier not available? Funny how now fox knows they are just making things up now, so they started by dumping colmes (not that he did much as a counter view) now they are just inviting identically opinioned morons to pat each other on the back and agree about everything? When is Fox going to be shut down??
and when you touch down, You'll find that it's stranger than known.
her in a hole and you sent the meanest, nastiest and tallest sf cop out to find her and capture him
they would probably turn it into a movie and call it....DIRTY HARRY
I'm tired of these hypothetical worst-case scenarios trotted out as a reason to make torture LEGAL. If, IF, such a crazy, desperate, rare, and unusual situation does come up, then that seems like it just might be justification to break the law and extract the needed info.
But the possible need to torture in this kind of (unlikely and definitely isolated) scenario doesn't justify needing to make torture legal for general information gathering.
Even the character Jack Bauer doesn't support legalizing torture and is always ready to face consequences.
Donavan Campbell "It's never good to identify them by name"
Does this apply to Valerie Plame?
it's not against the law.
Or if it's done as a political hit job because the undercover CIA agent's spouse uncovered the Vice's lies about WMD's that lead to a war that has killed 4500 Americans. IOKIYAR.
Bo Diddly has a turd under his nose from licking wingnut crack.
Because of their hypocrisy I couldn't watch the whole video clip. Do they even realize what show they are on, and what Bill'O does on a regular basis? Bill'O and his thugs ambush people at their homes, their work, and at the grocery store.
Or flat out liars.
I had a person try the same line on me the other day. To which I offered to waterboard him so he could decide if it was torture. He didn't take me up on the offer.
He tried to use the daughter line. I told him no matter what the reason it is an excuse for doing the wrong thing. That no matter what you say if you do the wrong thing it is always wrong. These people are just grabbing at straws like a drowning man going down for the last time. They will take anyone or anything they can down with them.
I am so ashamed of these cowards, so ashamed!
an independant thought. They have to be told what to say and what to do. I do think they are brainwashed.
And because of that you can't reason with them. Write them off, marginalize them. Focus on the future and make sure that the next generation knows that torture is just plain wrong, regardless of the circumstances.
If my child was about to be killed by terrorists and torturing the terrorist yielded info that my child was in Pakistan when in fact my child was in Iraq I hardly see what would be gained by the exercise.
That kind of logic would probably cause the turd on Bo's upper lip to fly off.
I just can't do it! These people (except the deer in the headlights in the middle) do it intentionally, all the time! I must not have what it takes..
Everyone of the these Pukes who are for torture begin with a positive: if you "knew" they had information re: a nuke, or your daughters, etc, so people then lean to it's ok to torture. But in real life (not the Repuke world of delusion) most of those interrogated have no idea what you are talking about. How many have we learned were just gathered up because they were there or just to justify Bushco's war. Then the innocent ones will give the intel you ask for, true or not just to make it stop. And the hard core will likely give you the wrong info because that's their job.
Torture has been proven unreliable by many who know but sick Pukes just loves them some torture none the less.
Damn, I wish they would bring in some of these talking heads and interrogate them re: plots to assasinate the President. I am sure within moments these Pukes would be admitting to the plot; even if it didn't exist.
http://deneroff.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2...
The wonderful insight into the Bo Dietl expert opinions.
Here is another awesome interview that tells an interesting tale of intellect.
http://www.thedailyshow.com/video/index.jhtml...
morale is low at CIA. Down from the high induced by having man like Dusty Foggo in day to day charge?
Does everyone realize that Bo Dietl is bestest buddies with Don Imus? This guy had a regular segment on Imus in the Morning when it was on MSNBC. He's a paid body-guard and thug. He's just another brainless tough-guy, paraded out to make stupid statements meant only to validate the position of the wing-nuts.
Water boarding and torture are against the law. I wonder how this ass-clown would react if a penny-less, homeless person were caught stealing food.
he must "be somebody"
What if, Mr. Dietl, a 2nd group of Al Qaeda child kidnappers took your kids and said they would kill your children if Obama tortured their friends? And, what if that other group that Obama had to torture including your own brother who was brainwashed by his aborted gay union leader to work for AQ?
And what if Chloe was really really close to breaking into the mainframe with the passwords to disable the magneto plasma ray gun?!
WHAT THEN Mr. Smart guy?!
I do NOT want you to interrogate ANYONE. I want you to get the hell out of the way and let a competent cop do it.
Here's what I don't understand - How come these people are so keen to torture people but no one is will to stand trial or go to jail for their country? If torturing a suspect is the right thing to do and is absolutely the only way to get valuable information that saves lives, I would think the pro-torture crowd should be proud to stand trial for defending their country and if necessary go to prison to protect their country. The terrorists are willing to die for their cause but the CIA and private interrogators are unwilling to break the law to get absolutely vital information that saves hundreds or thousands of American lives. I'm not agreeing with torture (I'm against it in all circumstances), I'm saying put your money where your mouth is. If you think this is right, do what's right and face the consequences.
The truth is most of the apologists are people like Rumsfeld, Cheney, Bush, Rice, Hannity, Scarborough ... people who have never served in the military and would never consider putting themselves at risk of danger for their country.
..it takes courage! That is one thing the people you mention severely lack. It also takes courage to stand on one's principles or to protect the morality of a nation.
Here's my scenario Mr. Dietl: one of your daughters is kidnapped and you think you have the guy "who knows" where she is. He tells you under duress (i.e., torture) what you want to hear. But, you're not stupid (ok, jury's still out) and you hold him, then you find her not there. Now what, more torture? At what point do you realize you're a fool and figure out you just tortured the wrong man because you thought he knew something but didn't. Will you turn yourself in? Have you helped your daughter at all? What now? tick-tick-tick.
Please stop the stupid scenarios. There are laws because we are civilized and a civilized world will work together to end the problems. Yes, somedays will be harder than others but at what price do we sacrifice our humanity. Not just our individual humanity but our universal humanity.
Calvin: "The surest sign of intelligent life in the universe is that nobody is trying to reach us!"
and WHAT IF THEY HAD A 500 ZILLION MEGATON BOMB AND WERE GOING TO BLOW UP THE WHOLE FUCKIN'WORLD?????OHMYGODOHMYGODOHMYGOD!!!!!!!!!
Stop! That plot line is torture enough
.
.
then what the times did was just fine
.
Only in bizarrow land...
... The Religious Right is Deadly wrong
... The Political Right is Constitutionally wrong
... Interrogation = TORTURE --- So wrong
.
A terrorist group makes a claim that they have an atomic bomb planted in NYC and they will detonate it unless we waterboard Karl Rove in the middle of Time Square. How is that for a scenario?
extended family and will torture them to death and set off a dirty bombs in every city over 100,000 unless you have sex with Hannity on live television while singing "A Few of My Favorite Things"?
Dude, I was totally in the middle of writing a novel in which that very thing happens!!
What a coincidence, GO FIGURE!!!
(ok, I was in the middle of thinking about writing a novel anyway)
I can't wait to see what scenarios we come up with!
Another of Don Imus' butt boys.
He knows as much about this topic as he knows about proper grammar.
Zoe Bartlett flashback except there's Veep and the Speakah of the House isn't an overfed right-wing blowhard like Blo.
Kudos to the Unloved One for rebuking him . . . oh wait, the little born again Catholic scold didn't do that. Must have been in my own West Wing episode . . .
the Bush administrative officials responsible for torture and then the phony Fox News punditry (and supportive guests) et al for accessories after the fact. Where were these whining crybabies when their hero W., the Conneticut yankee, drugstore cowboy, outed CIA agent Valerie Plame. What duplicitous asses.
I LOVE that guy! If I'd come across him in a novel, I would never have believed it, but he really does exist. A man with the singular attribute of rarely being able to form a sentence that doesn't contain the word "fuck". Thing is, you have to SEE him to get his batshit wackdoodle charm. He comes off like the hoariest of New York gangster cliches, and when he goes off on a rant, it's fucking POETRY.
Here is an exchange between ol' Bo and Mark Bakkedahl, from The Daily Show:
BD: You could be dildo-ized! Just think about that. Raving lesbionics. There could be a lotta lesbionics there; we don't know. And whattaya gonna do when eighty lesbionics try to run out of the prison? With no fences?
MB: So we've got hundreds of lesbionic dildo-wielding rapists...
BD: As in a lesbionic break.
MB:And why would the mayor of the town expose his people to such dangers?
BD: We don't know if Mayor Schmidt has a dildo fetish. We don't know if he likes dildos. We don't know if he likes lesbionics either. But it makes you think a little bit - There could have been a little motive that - a little motive behind this. No?
Is that not amazing? You can't make shit like that up.
So no, I'm not in the least surprised by anything Bo says. For regular viewers of TDS, he's already a legend.
A fucking legend.
I've posted this on threads on other sites, just FYI:
I am so sick of 24-esque ticking time bomb scenarios… In the real universe, that kind of situation essentially just doesn’t happen. But let’s go with it, for the sake of argument. Say that we have a captive, and we know to a reasonable degree of certainty that he knows the location and disarming code for a dirty bomb about to go off in NYC (how we could know that much without also knowing where the bomb is, I don’t have any idea, but let’s assume we do). Our intrepid defenders decide to use torture. There is absolutely no guarantee that it would work. Consider the most likely possibilities: 1) He just resists. Anyone entrusted with that information in the first place is going to be highly motivated, highly disciplined and probably a pretty tough hombre. And remember, in a real ticking time bomb situation, he doesn’t have to resist very long, just a matter of hours or perhaps a couple of days. 2) He lies. He pretends to break, but sends the good guys on a wild goose chase, or gives them a code that makes the bomb go off instantly. 3) If his cohorts know of his capture, which seems probable, they just move the bomb, or set it off earlier.
But let’s be charitable and assume that they get accurate information from him and save the day. Millions of lives are spared. Were I the president, I could, just maybe, in such a once-in-a-million-years scenario, where the consequences of failure would have been so catastrophic, be persuaded to give the torturers a clandestine pardon and cover up the incident. Maybe.
But this is a far cry from legalizing and normalizing torture in situations where we simply suspect that someone might have some information that might be useful someday, somehow, somewhere.
Moreover, even this, as reprehensible as it would be, is not even remotely the real situation. In reality torture was used not to get actionable intelligence, but in the hopes of securing false confessions, false data, that could bolster the administration’s case for invading Iraq. This is what torture is almost always used for. It’s why the North Koreans used torture on American GIs: to extract false confessions that would embarrass the US. The Inquisition used torture to extract confessions to convince the populace that they were surrounded by witches and heretics bent on their destruction, and to consolidate their temporal power (and confiscate the property of the condemned, of course). Stalin and Mao used torture to extract confessions for their show trials for similar reasons: “See, there are enemies everywhere, and only I can save you.”
And of course another reason torture is used is that some people just like to torture, or they get off on the power to have people tortured. I strongly suspect that this is a much bigger factor here than people want to face up to or talk about.
criminal....but
we didnt torture any of them
and americans on both coasts lived in constant fear of attack throughout ww2
so the 24 scenario works much better there
BUT WE DONT TORTURE
and since bush did...OFF WITH IS FUCKIN HEAD
Obama's daughters into this, specifically? Maybe I'm just too sensitive, but his doing that was just one more thing about what he had to say that rubbed me the wrong way.
At the same time, while I am trying to type this, I'm getting a good LOL at all of the scenarios y'all have come up with!
it was that you decided to use your energy to "correct" (i don't think anything was wrong, it was more of a specification) a possible misconception instead of communicating a sentiment that would dissuade one from the idea that torture is good.
your first comment was "well actually..."
just because someone doesn't infer what you imply does not make it their fault. perhaps the responses you've gotten have something to do with your communication or lack of context.
the "well actually..." would lead most people to believe that you are saying the torture being described isn't so bad.
perhaps clarifying what you thought to be a misunderstanding created another misunderstanding. those corrections can be tricky.
consisted of maybe 10 seconds of keyboard work so about a sip of coffee energy wise. And it was wrong because I didn't say "OMG torture is bad"?
And my first comment was not "well actually" My comment was that the previous poster grossly exaggerated the fact. And I didn't imply anything I stated a fact. If you choose to infer what I think by a stated fact, yes that is your fault. If you want to know what I think you are more than free to ask me.
In fact I'll answer without you asking, waterboarding is bad, so is incarceration, along with solitary confinement. All are necessary in some cases. And yes I'll say torture can be a decent punishment, at least as a good deterrent, do you think most of the 16-20 yr old gang banging punks would be as willing to do the crime if they knew the punishment was 20 hours on the rack followed by 10 hrs of hot irons, with a short followup of a glass rod inserted in the penis with the victim of their crime (or family if they were deceased) given a ballpeen hammer and told to go to town? Then followed by a quick hanging? Or even better yet a very slow electrocution with some jumper cables and wet sponges until their heart stopped?
I was willing to give you the benifit of the doubt...until I read that last paragraph. Sounds like you've thought long and hard about what you'd like to do to 16-20 year old gang banging punks. Did it bring a slight wisp of a smile to your face when you typed that?
and I haven't thought about it very much, but ask the parents of the numerous children that have been shot in drive byes by these sort of punks what they think of the idea. Personally I wouldn't want anyone to be tortured. Nor do I like to see anyone incarcerated, but it is necessary at least in the case of incarceration.
Three posts previous you stated, and I paraphrase; Torture, incarceration, and solitary confinement are all bad, but necessary.
I agree with you on incarceration, as long as the punishment fits the crime. Off the top of my head, too many Americans are serving long stretches of time for relatively minor drug charges.
Solitary confinement (maybe a better term would be seperate confinement) may be necessary in some cases to protect the prison population from specific violent prisoners. But if the punishment of solitary confinement is abused, it could be considered a form of torture in itself.
Torture has no proven value. It has no place in the American judicial system. Information obtained through the use of torture is often inacurate or outright false. When we torture we lower ourselves and our standards of morality to the base levels of organized and unorganized civilization.
As for the families of the victims of drive-by shootings, emotions run high, which is understandable. Regardless, the perpetrators of such acts should be made to face the penilties the same as any other citizen, no more, no less.
Seems to me that you prefer to see problems and solutions in terms of black and white. I wish things were that easy, but unfortunatly they are not.
prefer to see things in black and white, but I am also able to see shades of grey, torture is usually seen in a black and white view I am trying to see the grey, where I may not approve I can see the necessity of it in some instances.
And I agree that the incarceration of people for "victimless crimes" such as drugs and prostitution and such and other punishments are bs.
Great, so we have a little bit of common ground between us as far as incarceration goes. But concerning torture, just when is it acceptable?
And please, no plotlines from "24", let's keep this in the realm of reality.
for this, but for me? Rapists and child molesters to start, let the victims or victims familys at them, with a MD at hand to supervise and make sure the scum is kept alive and conscious enough to deal with a small bit of the anguish these people will have to deal with for the rest of their lives.
Wow, sounds more like revenge than justice. Not to mention that that has nothing to do with national security. How about we put rapists and child molesters in prison for very, very, very, very long times.
You asked when torture would be acceptable to me. That was a example of when I thought it might be acceptable.
I see. So things like basic human rights, the bill of rights, or even the constitution are looked at as something optional by you? Maybe you'd be more comfortable living in a country like Somalia, where vendetta and reprisal are more the norm than law and order.
I don't consider them optional, but the law provides for the removal of some rights from a felon. But there is that whole cruel and unusual thing.
timjoebillybob
No torture == no interrogation...
the jon stewart interview with that guy on torture (i forget his name) was similar...first he went from torture being 'discomfort that shocks the conscience' to 'anything uncomfortable so we shouldnt even put people in jail, is that what you want?' or something ridiculous like that....
Ok "Bo Dietl"...
so the President's two daughters are kidnapped.
And the FBI just happens to pick up someone who may know something about the case.
And that someone is YOUR daughter.
Maybe she knows something, maybe she knows nothing.
Should we torture HER to find out??
What absolute hysterical, moronic garbage.
i would hate to have to hear that shrill voice every day
Now everybody knows why this asshole was fired as a detective. Just too damn stupid and a proven liar.
If your son was in the Army and was captured by the Iraqis and they waterboarded him 25 times in order to find out when and where we planned on attacking one of their nuclear reactors, would it be OK with you?
In principle there's nothing wrong with the CIA, at least not compared with the atrocities committed by NSA and MOSSAD _DIRECTLY_ targeted at the NORMAL folks inside America and overseas. See e.g.
http://stewwebb.com/the_criminal_nsa_exposed.htm
http://www.angelfire.com/or/mctrl/akwei.html
It turns out that the NSA has been a KGB operation since its inception : http://crashrecovery.org/forrestal/
About the CIA. Bush the elder created the boyscout club within the CIA in 1976, and Bush the younger tried to dismantle the CIA. There has in recent weeks been a massive blackpainting campaign against the CIA, to make it the sole scapegoat of the torture outrages in Iraq and elsewhere etc.
It would indeed be a heaven on earth for FSB/NSA if the CIA would be closed. So stop pounding on the CIA, if you don't know what your talking about.
the Communists and KGB/FSB/NSA including MOSSAD are infested all over America. Its like a disease. When searching for CIA on conspiracycentral I get 70 or more videos. For KGB nothing can be found on the subject, likewise when searching for a serious study and biography of Vladimir Putin. That's no coincidence ...
http://crashrecovery.org/current/concentral-f...
Login or Register to post comments.