Sen. Dick Durbin explains why Guantanamo should be closed and uses Major Alexander's explanation. Newt smears Alexander
By John Amato Sunday May 24, 2009 9:50am
The Republicans are so devoid of leadership that they couldn't even offer up a sitting elected member of their party to go on Meet the Press, so they chose disgraced ex-House Leader Newt Gingrich to debate Sen. Dick Durbin on issues of what they consider national security.
David Gregory should look at his ratings one of these days. Gingrich is a washed up gasbag that FOX News has been using for years to smear the Democratic Party. I know he's a good smear merchant; he's quite the professional, but why is he on MTP in the middle of this discussion? Where is an active member of the GOP? I guess Limbaugh was too busy to come on today and represent like a good homey.
SEN. DURBIN: Just remember that President Bush called for the closing of Guantanamo; President Obama did the same, as did Senator McCain in the last campaign. And I also want to remind the former speaker that Major Matthew Alexander, who has actually interrogated al-Qaeda suspects in Iraq, attributes half of the deaths of Americans in Iraq to the detention abuses at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo. Continuing Guantanamo, unfortunately, makes our troops less safe. The bottom line as I see it is Guantanamo should close in an orderly way. President Obama announced that last Thursday. We understand that at the end of the day there will be some of these people, I don't know the exact number, who will be too dangerous to be released, and President Obama said he would work with Congress and the courts to detain them in a humane, constitutional and legal way.
Gingrich immediately smears the military by saying that Durbin can always find a single troop member from the 550K that served in Iraq that would agree with your point of view.
REP. GINGRICH: Let me say, first of all, there were over 550,000 troops who served in Iraq. I'm sure you can find one to agree with you.
Does Gingrich believe that 550K troops were interrogating prisoners? Maj. Alexander is uniquely qualified to speak on such matters since, but Newt effortlessly smears him and then uses 9/11 to fudge the facts. After 9/11, we invaded Iraq which created thousands of more terrorists. There is no debate about this and the horrors at Gitmo and Abu-Ghraib fueled the fire and Gingrich knows it too.
Gregory had to ask Durbin for proof that Gitmo and Abu-Ghraib created more terrorists than ever before. Where has he been these last eight years? Curious that he didn't ask Cheney for proof for his assertions. Durbin has to reiterate the same point twice.
via MTP transcript:
MR. GREGORY: How long should Gitmo remain open?
REP. GINGRICH: Until the war is over.
MR. GREGORY: When is that?
REP. GINGRICH: We'll--when the terrorists disappear. I mean, you're faced with...
MR. GREGORY: Well, you're talking about a pretty long-term proposition here.
Gingrich wants these dungeons left open until the end of the war, my God.
REP. GINGRICH: Yes, because this is a long-term proposition. You have people out there today who want to kill Americans, who would like to set off a nuclear weapon in an American city, who would like to set off a truck bomb down the street from where we are right now. These folks are serious. They're, they're still there. They're fighting in Pakistan right now, they're fighting in Iraq right now. We just arrested four people in New York City last week. What do you do with somebody who's a dedicated, religiously-motivated terrorist? You had better keep them locked up.
MR. GREGORY: But, Senator, what about this issue of conversion in prison? What about the FBI director saying that there are concerns if you bring some of these figures into U.S. prisons?
SEN. DURBIN: Just remember that President Bush called for the closing of Guantanamo; President Obama did the same, as did Senator McCain in the last campaign. And I also want to remind the former speaker that Major Matthew Alexander, who has actually interrogated al-Qaeda suspects in Iraq, attributes half of the deaths of Americans in Iraq to the detention abuses at Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo. Continuing Guantanamo, unfortunately, makes our troops less safe. The bottom line as I see it is Guantanamo should close in an orderly way. President Obama announced that last Thursday. We understand that at the end of the day there will be some of these people, I don't know the exact number, who will be too dangerous to be released, and President Obama said he would work with Congress and the courts to detain them in a humane, constitutional and legal way.
MR. GREGORY: Let me pick--I want to pick up on a point here, and this is another argument that the president made with regard to keeping the prison at Guantanamo Bay open, and the, the stain on the U.S. image because of that. This is what he said.
(Videotape)PRES. OBAMA: Instead of serving as a tool to counter terrorism, Guantanamo became a symbol that helped al-Qaeda recruit terrorists to its cause. Indeed, the existence of Guantanamo likely created more terrorists around the world than it ever detained.(End videotape)
MR. GREGORY: Senator Durbin, where's the evidence to support that claim?
SEN. DURBIN: I just gave it to you: Major Matthew Alexander, who interrogated the al-Qaeda suspects in Iraq. And it was his conclusion that half of them had been recruited and were fighting, trying to kill Americans because of Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo. Are we going to ignore this? The fact is that closing Guantanamo, that announcement by the president, as well as abandoning torture techniques and so-called enhanced interrogation, finally said to the rest of the world that it's a new day. Join us in a new approach to keeping this world and America safe. I think it was a break from the past we desperately needed. And to turn around now and to take the approach that Mr. Limbaugh has suggested, that Newt Gingrich has suggested, Vice President Cheney, would put us back in that same terrible position where our troops will be less safe by continuing Guantanamo.
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He is a cheater and wife beater, so who cares what the hell he's lying about daily.
Instead of referring to them as 'REP GINGRICH' and 'MR GREGORY', can you just use the more apropos 'Salamander' and 'Toadie'?
Thank you.
and even though "hand job" Gregory's ratings are in the shit can, MSNBC will continue to keep this cancer on the human race on the air forever and never mind the fact that this joke that is David Gregory is nothing more than a republican KISS-ASS and should be fired but NO, MSNBC, in it's infinite wishdom give's this cocksucker another hour on their network! If it wasn't for Ed,Keith, and Rachel, I wouldn't watch MSNBC at all! When the hell are they going to get rid of"Mournin' Blow" with fellow hand jobbers, Mika and Willie?Oh for the good luck to run into Willie in a bar and just hurl insults at this guy until he CRY'S for his momma or Mika!P.S For all you spell checkers out there, I'm fully aware of the way I spelled morning!Btw way Joe(Blow)have you MURDERED any interns lately?
That it had to be posted twice?
feel better about the times when I've done it. It happens to the best of us.
Too bad Mr. Gregory doesn't bother to listen to anything his guests are saying and just plows right into the next talking point/"question". Dog, I miss the days when people were interviewed instead of just given platforms for their spin.
" MR. GREGORY: How long should Gitmo remain open?
REP. GINGRICH: Until the war is over.
MR. GREGORY: When is that?
REP. GINGRICH: We'll--when the terrorists disappear. I mean, you're faced with...
MR. GREGORY: Well, you're talking about a pretty long-term proposition here."
So, didn't Bush declare combat operations to be over way back in May 2003? Perhaps "Toadie" could ask that question....
This is one reason why Israel will never make peace with the Palestinians. Without eternal conflict, the right wing in both Israel and the U.S. has no platform. They have nothing to stand on, let alone run on.
The terrorists will never disappear. That's not within anyone's power but the terrorists themselves. What's within our power is giving them more fuel for their fire. It's to the political right's advantage to fan the flames.
"When the terrorists disappear" is really a false argument. It represents an already-tested, failed option.
Exactly. As long as there are people willing to use violence to achieve their political will, there will always be terrorists.
Terrorism is a TACTIC, Mr. Gingrich, and once you pull your head out of your ass, you might be able to distinguish this point.
"Until the war is over."
Corollary to: "Perpetual War For Perpetual Peace" - George Orwell, "1984"
of office a while ago?
What's he doing with an opinion about anything?
newt is being politically opportunistic. there are many more that have/do want to close gitMO. newt is fully aware of the difficulties that obama will have closing gitMO. BUSH had the same difficulties. gitMO
is international symbolism for the BUSH hypocrisy. closing gitMO represents change that will be recognized throughout the world. obama is fully aware of this. newt doesn't want to waste an opportunity to rally the RIGHT base that supported BUSH and his crusade.
Margaret,
No one made you read both of them, did they?
There *IS* no end to "the war." It just goes on and on and on...that's the whole point.
The more war, the more money to be made, the better the chances we'll be attacked again sooner, the more likely it will be Americans react fearfully and angrily, the more likely it is Republicans are reinstalled into power, the more money there is to be made...
And so it goes...
There can be no victory, there are no sides. We are not fighting anything that has the capability to surrender. We are fighting a tactic that will exist as long as there are those willing to define/redefine it. This war perpetuates itself.
Who are we fighting, in this war? Terrorists? What terrorists? Where are they?
We are fighting the entire Middle East that only wants us out. As long as we are there, they will want us to leave. As long as we stay, they are the terrorists. But we can’t leave, because they are there.
This is not a war. This is not even an occupation. This is lunacy.
The Vonnegut quote, "And so it goes," seemed apropos to me, too.
Who are we fighting? Good question. It seems like we are at war with what Lincoln called "the better angels of our nature." In short, it appears we are at war with ourselves and who we imagine ourselves to be.
We are at war with Eurasia. Or is it Oceana? I forget.
the bankrupt morality of these republicans/conservatives/dinos.
Will someone inform the (RNC) Racist Nazi Committee that we who have served and did not HIDE like the SPINELESS GUTLESS COWARD gingrich, I just ask he go back and salivate on the NEO CON HATE MONGERING chritian right ZIPPER and make them happy when he tells them he SWALLOWS.
This piece of Fecal matter can say NOYHING.
We were ATTACKED on their WATCH because they were DERILICT in their duties. If they DID their job we WOULD NOT have this problem. How does one reason with aa COWARD
R ush: Combat dodging chickenhawk coward
N ewt: Combat dodging chickenhawk coward
C heney: Combat dodging chickenhawk coward
In fact, the latter killed 4600 Americans in a trumped up war. More than Bin Laden.
…but even the Dutch think we’re pussies.
And there is certainly no "war on terror". This was a complete contrivance pushed on the American people by the Bush administration in order to further their own agenda of greedy and corrupt war profiteering. It's that simple. Sort of like an american "jihad" on islam. Go figure!
Who on this list would trust most and trust least to keep America safe?
http://www.awolbush.com/whoserved.html
Further proof that Gingrich is a complete scumbag. He's willing to lie and smear and the press won't call him on it because they like their headlines.
he just became a Catholic. So now, he's new and improved and holier than thou. So he must be right....right?
could remember the ground rules, we wouldn't have to have these discussions on TV week after week. Repeat after me, "Only Republicans are patriots...Only Republicans love this country....Only Republicans are tough enough to deal with our enemies, real or contrived.....Only Republicans walk on water."
I'm glad, thought, that Durbin is citing Alexander. Alexander isn't the only one to point this out, but it's long past time this truth made it into the torture "debate."
Since Newt claims to undertand thew workings of war and the military mindset, i assume he must have served in the military?
Or his he YET ANOTHER chickenhawk Republican who never served, and loves war provided someone else does the dying?
If he was doin the dying he wouldn't have as much face time on the tee vee.
MR. GREGORY: How long should Gitmo remain open?
REP. GINGRICH: Until the war is over.
You all still don't get it; the military industrial complex would like nothing better than perpetual war! That’s what the “war on terror” is all about!
They want an eternal war against people that don't like us. Later during the interview he said we (American people) should be afraid. And they keep using the Clinton Admin in both World Trade Center bombings. He was in office for 1 month during the first and out of office 9 months during the second. Not sure how both are Clinton's fault. And the notion there has not been terrorism on Americans since 9/11, which they love bringing up, is not true. There has been attacks on Embassies in the middle east after that day. But we will never hear that because they were not large enough to garner the notice of the media.
Now the talking points are about nuclear weapons. I am sure some people would love to use nuclear weapons against the US, but wanting to and have the ability to acquire, transport and detonate a bomb in the US is trickier. I would love to see the evidence on this one, which there probably isn't any.
for the 6th nuke that they flew from Minot?
This never should have been a "war on terror" in the first place. The Cheney administration wanted to treat terrorists like soldiers, until it came time to treat them like POWs. If we had approached it as a law enforcement problem -- with corollary police-actions in cooperation with allies -- we'd have murderers in prison and on death-row, by now.
The GOP wants to have it both ways, but now the evidence is tainted by torture and suspension of habeas corpus. Obama called it correctly when he said this is a "mess." The GOP sees a military solution for everything, even the flagging economy, and so erodes our civilization. Now, they're just grasping at straws in an attempt to make political hay out of closing Gitmo, while the real issues of terror, torture and universal human rights take a back seat. Grrr.
For more on this argument, check out my blog "The Scary Files" and particularly this post:
http://scaryfiles.bentzine.net/2009/05/closin...
"REP. GINGRICH: Until the war is over." Only Congress can declare war. Any other military action is either an invasion or self-defense. You should know this and understand the consequences of this deception. Your public self-loathing will shame all of your future spawn.
He mentioned those arrested in NYC lately to defend Gitmo? What the hell does one thing have to do with the other? Is he planning to send then to guantanamo bay? What an idiot.
How do you know that a national broadcast network is going into the crapper?
ans. They schedule old gutter gums Ginrich for an appearance.
What Newtie wants is no more relevant to what goes on in the world than what my cats want and they want tuna right now. Gingrich is a has been right wing demagogue who has Sunday morning bobbleheads swooning. Why I don't know. Maybe Cheney is overbooked.
What a dishonest lying sack of dog shit newt is!
They just make up excuses and lies and act like they know what they are talking about while lying every breath.
republicanism is a mental illness and the salamander and the toadie are prime examples of insanity. Pure and simple lying assholes.
I would love to get newt and waterboard the sorry bastard.
It is just getting to be too hard to watch these lying scum. I don't think I will ever watch again.
Gingrich wants these dungeons left open until the end of
the wartime, my God.Fixed it.
one ugly son of a bitch from the inside out!
How can such a violent and stupid man be allowed to speak on a national forum?
Is that Al Qaida was nearly defunct because the rest of the muslim world was disgusted with their tactics. Attacking the US was their hail mary pass and would have seriously backfired had it not been for the dumb giant overreacting under the command of the neocon assholes.
These right wing toadie chickenhawk cowards just voted last week to rename the Democratic party the Democrat Socialist Party. Who the hell fought their wars for them .... a hell of a lot of democrats fought that's who, myself included! And I resent to the nth degree those assholes calling me a socialist behind my patriotic back and invite any of thier spineless simpering selves to my front door and call me that to my face!
Now, as for this coversation NEWT! We spawned more terrorists by by invading a sovereign nation (Iraq)based on a pack of neocon lies so Bush and his cronies could get their cowardly, greedy hands on Iraqs oil than Osama Bin Ladin ever thought of having or could recruit.
Bush, Cheney, Rove, Gonzales they are the real terrorists of the world if terrorism is based upon the numbers of people killed. We have lost close to 5000 American men and the estimate is imprecise, but I have read 650,000 Iraqi's have been killed so far. That to me is terrorism, and Bush and the whole damn lot of them who voted for this war in Iraq are terrorists! Had we not been lied into this war, I would have had an entirely different opinion, but we WERE LIED INTO WAR TO GET AT IRAQI OIL SO AMERICAN BUSINESSMEN COULD GET FILTHY RICH, and that makes us well what would you call it?
Newt, get out of our faces you hypocritical prick! Why anyone would even care one iota about your opinion on anything is beyond me. David Gregory is just another chearleader for the right, and I wish Fox would have gotten him before Tim Russert died for Christs sake! I won't watch Meet the Press ever again until they get his ass off the anchor chair.
I hate to put it in graphic terms, but the arguments put forward by The Newt are fulla crap. Dick Durbin destroyed every once of them.
Gingrich knows full well these prisoners could be contained fully within the US prisons and that a good share of them were not hardened terrorists. All this is is a phony issue Republicans use to appeal to their shrinking moronic, white-power, foreigner-hating base to try to build up a party that nobody actually gives a shit about any more.
You know it's bad when The Newt gets punked on "The Daily Show" and doesn't realize he looks like a fool. Pathetic, disgusting man.
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