Detainee-abuse photos about to be released, Fox's Smith and Herridge report
By David Neiwert Wednesday May 13, 2009 5:45am
Get ready for Abu Ghraib Redux:
[N]ow a new batch of photographs, perhaps hundreds of images, of prisoners being abused is about to be made public. It comes at a time when the debate over prisoner mistreatment is still roiling America's political and public conscience. The new photographs are being made public in a victory for the American Civil Liberties Union. And the Pentagon, after fighting, and losing, three federal court reviews of the matter, has waved the white flag and is now preparing to release the pictures. Some of the photographs are official; some, like the original Abu Ghraib collection, taken informally by soldiers. "We know this could make things tougher for our troops," a senior Pentagon official says, "but the court decisions really don't leave us with any other option."
Fox's Shepard Smith and Catherine Herridge presented the Fox version of this story yesterday, reporting that May 28 is the date set for the release of at least some of the photos. Herridge says that someone who's seen them told her none of them are as bad as the Abu Ghraib shots, but about 44 of them could be very ugly indeed.
And there's this note:
Smith: Some of the critics are really labeling this 'Abu Ghraib Part II.'
Herridge: Well, you remember that after Abu Ghraib there was worldwide condemnation for these images of humiliation. And I learned in my research today that there was also a military report in 2008 that concluded that there is a connection between these images and also suicide bombers. Forty-eight bombers, or potential bombers, were interviewed, and they said that these images were a big factor, a big motivating factor, in the decision to become a suicide bomber.
This in fact comports with that 2006 National Intelligence Estimate [PDF file] that found that Bush's war in Iraq had actually created the conditions for a future ripe with terrorist attacks; or, as the New York Times put it, "helped spawn a new generation of Islamic radicalism." Among the real motivators for terrorist recruitment, it found, was the torture regime the Bush administration set up in places like Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib.
If anyone thought that photos from those centers would not eventually leak out to the public -- or at the bare minimum, be forced out eventually by the inevitable lawsuits, as was the case here -- they were fooling themselves. Or at least gambling that they'd be out of office by then and could lay the whole mess in the laps of whoever had the misfortune to succeed them.
Indeed, the Obama critics are now out in force shouting that the pending release of these photos will hurt soldiers in the field, including Joe Lieberman and Lindsey Graham. Bill Kristol is claiming that "this would be a gratuitous assault on the well-being and the reputation of our fighting men and women."
But of course, they can't answer the cold fact that these photos are a product of the Bush administration's misbegotten policies, and the reaction to them from the Arab world -- indeed, the rest of the world -- puts the lie to Dick Cheney's claim that "enhanced interrogations" kept us safe.
In fact, over the long run, they have made us quantifiably less safe. And cleaning out this festering wound once and for all is the only hope we have of healing it.
Herridge's story has an on-point quote from the ACLU, which sued to get these photos released:
"The people in the pictures are guilty, but it does not stop and it is dangerous for us to assume that this is just a few bad apples," said Jonathan Hafetz, an attorney with the group. "This was at the highest levels of the U.S. government, a policy of state-approved torture that the U.S. committed and carried out throughout the Bush administration."
Incidentally, Robert Gibbs was asked about it by Fox News' Major Garrett yesterday:
Q Robert, Senators Graham and Lieberman have written the President a letter about pending release of the photographs of the treatment of detainees, and they would like the President to consider reversing that decision made by the Justice Department and the Department of Defense. And in their letter, they say the release of these old photographs of past behavior --
MR. GIBBS: Well, let me -- the decision made by the Department of Defense and the Department of Justice relating to a series of court cases dating back to September of 2008, as well as an appeals case dating back to March 11.
Go ahead.
Q That's the legal foundation, yes. And in their letter, they say this will "serve no public good" -- I'm quoting now -- "but will empower al Qaeda propaganda operations, hurt our country's image, and endanger our men and women in uniform." Is this something that is being considered by the President for reversal or is this a policy that will go forward? And does he have any anxiety about the potential consequences of the release of these photographs?
MR. GIBBS: Well, obviously the President has great concern about any impact that pictures of detainee -- potential detainee abuse in the past could have on the present-day service members that are protecting our freedom either in Iraq, Afghanistan, or throughout the world. That's something the President is very cognizant of, and we are working to -- we are working currently to figure out what the process is moving forward.
Q Does this mean -- does that mean the decision could be reversed?
MR. GIBBS: I don't want to get into that right now.
Q So you can't commit either way?
MR. GIBBS: I'm not going to add much to that right now.
We'll see what that means in the days to come, no doubt.








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the more the public outcry for the prosecution of the boosh administration will grow.
"Hey, I said we should move on - but the people have demanded an accounting. And I'm a servant of the people."
Torture is wrong. Period.
I think our shiny new president is a LOT smarter than I originally thought...and even then I knew he was smarter'n most.
I just read that Obama is going to try to block the pictures from being released. If he does, it proves to me that he is trying to protect bushco instead of upholding the Constitution.
I'm certain most Americans will be totally against it then.
... presuming a debate where facts have the ascendancy, and not this 'ends justifies the means' horseshit Cheney has been given free rein to spew, or where the media isn't treating torture as a valid difference of acceptable foreign policy.
We really shouldn't have to see more photos to show us the extent of how horrible and/or widespread this is.
After all, "they", that evil "they", cut off peoples' heads and so why shouldn't we torture OR they did it first OR we are following orders. A guy robs a bank and then, before he's caught, he gives away thousands of dollars to no one in particular without the recipient knowing where the money came from, who gives it back? Just another silly scenario.
I hope your right but if more people were against it now, wouldn't there be some accountability? Hasn't happened yet!
The release of the photos, coupled with the prosecution of those responsible, are the best way to showing the world that this behavior was an aberration and not in keeping with American morals. We are not and never will be a perfect country, but we ought to be one that will admit our mistakes and do our best to correct them.
After the Obama administration released the OLC memos on enhanced interrogation techniques, our British allies must have figured that the US would not object to publicizing the techniques used on Binyam Mohamed, now in the UK after being released from Guantanamo Bay. Barack Obama clarified his position on exposing intel techniques in a letter to the Brits that more or less told them to do what he says, and not what he does.
In other words, Obama's political play in releasing the OLC memos continues to backfire on him. Amateur hour continues in the West Wing
Another I told you so moment.
.
either don't get my jokes or don't find them funny. Why should I address your first problem here only for you apply your second.
Tyler: I don't get it. Oh, now I get it. It is not funny.
Just hit the ignore button on me, please.
Besides the bridge over your head collapsing, what the hell are you afraid of?
Really?
Seems to me that Obama is the consummate professional, and the boosh misadministration was chock full of sycophantic fascist amateurs...
Top to bottom.
... and your latest troll droppings are specially aromatic.
I bet you are one of those who complain about the PC police when you can't use the term n*gger in the open anymore, yet you have no qualms using the term "enhanced interrogation techniques" instead of "torture" which is the simpler and more straight forward term for what went on under your "pro" Bush/Cheney dynamic duo from hell.
"if you can't dazzle them with brilliance...baffle them with bullshit."
Of course, rule one is..."never let the facts get in the way."
.............of exactly this. Keep their feet to the fire. Keep the pressure on the coup de tat, the junta from Hell.
Yep, cheney is running as fast as he can to stay ahead of what's rolling up fast behind him. I wonder when he will return to his undisclosed location to hide. Hopefully that big thing approaching him fast from behind will catch up with him before he can get away.
n/t
Brazil a country with zero treaties with the USA for extradition?
nut.
a hard nut to crack.
a rather huge ranch in Paraguay, which was apparently purchased for that reason. Previously, Paraguay had no extradition treaty with the US, but their newest President vowed to change that - I don't know if that happened yet.
not to run away from extradition, let's face no one in their right mind will prosecute a former US president... it ain't gonna happen, period. But they bought the place, and it is supposed to be a large land lease, because of the large fresh water reserves.
It seems that the Bushes are counting on a massive climate shift and water will become a precious commodity. These leaches, as usual, try to profit from our natural resources and people's plight. Prescott will ever be so proud of his offspring, evil to the core... just like granddaddy liked it.
Did the last administration consider the effect torturing people would have on our military men and women at the time they okayed these techniques?
I don't want to see the pictures. I haven't gotten over the feelings I felt when I saw the first ones. I couldn't wrap my head around the idea that this was Americans doing these sorts of things to human beings. It was like watching a horror movie but this time I couldn't console myself by reminding myself that it wasn't real.
... in most any group. What separates good groups from bad groups is that good groups police themselves.
it just made me sick to think Americans did this
but, what is worse to contemplate: a few soldiers in the insanity of war humiliating/torturing who they 'perceive' as enemies OR
the fact that supposedly erudite, intelligent leaders of our political, military and economic institutions plotted and planned to invade sovereign nations, enable barbaric behavior, and ruin our economy????
time. Under orders. Tiger Force. Operation Phoenix. School of the Americas. MK Ultra. Operation Condor. The various dictators who have operated under US instruction and support. The US has been torturing, and killing by torture, by decades. Who did you think our government was?
or maybe 1492.
torture has only come around since WW2 and the rise of the CIA and the military-industrial-entertainment complex and our shadow government. Not surprisingly, the Bush family has been intimately involved with the creation of this era's worst crimes.
complex.
Torture was used extensively by the US military in the "Banana Republic Wars" of the 1890s in central America.
It was also used against the Phillipinos in the early 1900s.
Yhese wars were fought for the convenience of corporations such as United Fruit and Goodyear.
for using water torture on a Phillino prisoner.
... from their perspective, the US government has had quite an institutionalized policy of aggression, repression, and elimination of dissent regarding native Americans.
But also, the church was instrumental in the subjugation of the Native Americans. Convert or die in many cases.
institutionalized torture that is. Institutionalized torture did also exist hundreds of years ago. It was thought to be dead until bushco brought it's corpse back to life.
When complaints were raised about wiretapping, the reps came back with "If you have nothing to hide, what's the problem?" I wonder if they'll feel the same way about these photos being released. DOUBT IT!
"We know this could make things tougher for our troops," a senior Pentagon official says, "but the court decisions really don't leave us with any other option."
It is the PENTAGON that did this. Not the ACLU. Not the courts. They had options. They decided to be nazis in US uniforms.
I want to see all involved parties, Dem or Republican, investigated and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I'd also, like to say thank you to all the blind Cheney/Bush followers who voted for these war criminals. Thanks. We all get to pay for it now!
Well, if LIEberman and Graham object, then put the releases of this stuff that condemns them into the spot light FAST!!! I'd love nothing better than to have those two mouth-pieces 'uncomfortable' with the disclosure.
If the United States can strip and deport naturalized American Demjanjuk of his citizenship, they can strip and deport John Yoo of his naturalized American citizenship as well -- and should!
that John Yoo was born in Seoul.
Send the Seoul-Man back to Korea.
in recent years, and despite the warranties on their cars I doubt the South Koreans will allow either a return or exchange of goods in this case.
as a result of the release of these photos will be a whole new generation of conservatives who believe liberals have betrayed our troops.
exactly the same way that photos of people smoking tobacco cause lung-cancer...
Fuuking maroons: It's the actions portrayed that cause the camage, n ot the images themselves...
Chuy...
about the impact of propaganda on violent actors.
as the New York Times put it, "helped spawn a new generation of Islamic radicalism." (out of context but accurate I think)
Way to go W. How's that legacy thing-ee comin'?
You know, from now on, instead something being "F"-d up, I think "W"-d up is more appropriate. Shut the W up! Get the W out of here! Who the W do you think you are? We are W-d! See, it works on many levels.
So?
Better to fight them over there than over here.
A dead American in Iraq is better than a dead American in Manhattan.
..the war in Iraq was illegal. We went there so we wouldn't have to fight them here. So why is the threat level still so high. We went there because of a link with al-Qaeda & 9/11. There was none. We went there because of WMD's. There weren't any. We went there to free the people. Thousands killed, millions displaced and how many more tortured. When Bush first approached America about this, he presented his arguments with an air of uncertainty that he would not commit troops until ALL the facts were in. He used questionable sources. They didn't support the troops with the right equipment. There was no al-Qaeda in Iraq until we invaded. They ended up trying, convicting and hanging Saddam Hussein because he tortured and killed Iraqis but is Bush being held accountable in like fashion. They hired the VP's company to improperly wire showers causing the death of some of our troops. And here it is..SIX W-ing years since that criminal invaded Iraq.
Now I don't care what side of this debate you're on..why is it we are still there after the Mission was Accomplished? What were they thinking? Whether they were altruistic, they did for oil, they did it for the Iraqi people, whatever..how are we better off for it? Exxon-Mobil got record profits last year. KBR is still in business after commiting murder (negligent homicide is probably more accurate). Servicemen are flipping out and killing their comrades. Think about our dead, our wounded. When will this nightmare end?
Please Mr. President, Mr. Attorney General: Appoint the Special Prosecutor and prosecute the war criminals! This must never happen again!
they killed Hussein to keep him from testifying in court. Just as so many accidents and suicides have happened to people that probably had some very interesting things to say.
... a straw house is still a straw house.
We've done jack to improve the nation's infrastructure and protect it (not pre-emptively, but to make sure it still functions in the wake of an attack) while we've pissed around in Iraq and tortured people to 'keep us safe.'
Both are still dead. Which one took others with him?
I'm taking bets, come May 28 will we have:
a) An outbreak of manbearpig flu?
b) The disappearance of a pretty, blonde, white girl?
c) A "terrorist" attack?
d) A Democratic leader caught with a mistress?
This is a big enough deal that I'm putting lowest odds on "c". BushCo/CheneyDyne are going to need a LOT of cover to hide behind this.
On the following Sunday the talking head shows will be filled with Villagers and deposed Bush officials talking about why Obama's failure to stop the release of these photos has made us unsafe.
..........yeh!, that swine-flu thingie did the trick the last time. What will be the next distraction? I'd go with 'C', too. Torture could unravel their net of lies, blackmail, corruption, nepotism, etc. and..........CHENEY IS SCARED! Nothing like a desparate crook in high places with friends like MOSSAD!
psyche with this stuff and are more concerned with basic economic "survival" and are ready to turn the page.
I bet that the more images and intel that come about the torture program, the more angry people will get and will start demanding to see prosecutions in ever increasing numbers.
The Will Of The People can only be ignored for so long.
Nothing personal.
the general public.
A time is going come when all the high ideals replace brother killing brother, clan clashing with clan, races and nations destroying one another, etc. . but it's going to be a while.
I'm not suggesting you not believe in your vision of justice.
will take many generations.
I'm speaking of this case here, in front of us as we speak.
The more damning info that comes out. The more people make noise about it, the more pressure on this administration to prosecute the last.
I for one will continue to be one of the noise makers.
giving each other high fives and shouting "We got it."
and extremely painful to see the current state this world is in.
It's not funny at all.
my petty amusements from.
Not a funny situation at all...
... his sense of humor is a tad miscalibrated. He tries though...
he does try, lol!
"... his sense of humor is a tad mis"sing.
I was thinking the same thing when I wrote a comment on this thread without reading yours first.
survival....but, unlike some of our former leaders, I'm able to focus on more than one thing at a time.
And, I'd be quite delighted to watch the prosecution of Cheney/Bush and all of the ancillary players who've worked so hard to disgrace and bring down America.
Evet -
Can't turn the page until you have read it first. Guess you prefer the Cliffs Notes
I think you are wrong about financially pressured people who now have the criminality of the junta from hell right at their doorsteps, not safely in DC. No $$$$, No future, No job, No place to turn, cornored rats can also turn on each other, No hope, so............where does ones mind turn? To what happened to a livable country, is where my mind goes, to the criminals who are responsible.
I think you are wrong about financially pressured people who now have the criminality of the junta from hell right at their doorsteps, not safely in DC. No $$$$, No future, No job, No place to turn, cornored rats can also turn on each other, No hope, so............where does ones mind turn? To what happened to a livable country, is where my mind goes, to the criminals who are responsible.
Reslugs are so scared that they are now screaming, covering up, lying and wetting their panties.
worst of the torture documents. Audio and video recordings, especially. I believe Hersh mentioned something about child rape at Abu Ghraib.
shortly after the abu Ghraib story came out that one of the videos contained scenes of the sodomy rape of a 14 year old boy in front of his mother in order to get them to tell where their Iraqi military officer husband/dad was months after the illegal invasion. As if they had any idea! The story said that this video was watched by some members of the Senate and that Leahy was shocked and disgusted by it. This was in 2004! 5 years later and we still don't have the war criminals locked in prison! WTF?
Their claiming ignorance is just a little suspect.
The Senate or the mother and son?
Members of the senate.
but wasn't positive you weren't going for the snark.
and a certain regular here, who shall remain nameless, gave me hell about it.
some regulars here aren't quite what they try to appear to be.
is a scourge which respect no one regardless of social standing.
I was absolutely livid when Obama suggested that he may not prosecute the former administration, but now I am suspecting that he is playing a very intelligent game of assuring public opinion for the procedings to go smooth. First release the memos and bait neocons to justify torture, then start showing horrifying pictures to gather public opinion and expose these criminals. I think this is working pretty well.
the boomers portfolios which formerly groaned with earnings and have little left but IOU's remaining. The torture thing is pretty low on the list.
I don't think so...not everyone is motivated by greed.
at the risk of soundin even more geeky...to paraphrase Samwise in the LOTR trilogy...
"There is some good left in this world, and it is worth fighting for."
There will be a bunch of righteous Americans who still care. But the majority, by large, do not give a rat's ass about torture while this economic meltdown is going on. Period.
Obama, like Clinton, was mostly elected because of "the economy stupid." Like father like son, both Bushes managed to leave office with the US economy in tatters. Why people continue to vote and support the Bush clan is a clear example of how short sighted and amnesiac a big chunk of our population is.
aren't greedy, some are ambitious and successful, but not greedy.
I think the majority ARE the righteous Americans who still care.
The ones who don't give a rats ass about torture beacuse of the economy being in shambles right now, are likely the ones who don't give a rats ass about torture when the economy is strong...IMHO, they are the teabaggin, bush/mccain/palin supportin anti-American assholes who helped get us into this mess to begin with. the 21 percenters...
you folks have hit "American society" right on the head.
My husband just got laid off, and I care about this very much. Don't assume we can't worry about more than one thing at a time.
I gree with you. To assume that most americans don't give a damn about what's morally and legally right is to assume that conservatism was not defeated and rejected on the last election. If this is not important enough, we might as well rip the declaration of independence and constitution. These documents have only one use for neocons: toilet paper.
Exactly! Obama/Biden/Holder have a strategy in place. I couldn't agree more. Let's face it. These guys are brilliant.
Those were Joe Biden's words during the campaign in reference to Cheney. And definitely not a gaffe.
but our using torture keeps us safe...
can anyone explain that nugget of right wing illogic?
head of the household raises multiple welts on the child's buttocks and even draws some blood as the child resists the correction. The family is therefore safe from further bad behavior by the child. However, if the child shows the school nurse the damage, then the family is put at risk.
Another option - getting our troops the hell out of there - is not in the cards.
'Just following orders' is no excuse.
If they're not criminals, then every Nazi concentration camp prison guard in WW2 was innocent too, as they were just 'following orders'.
it's a beautiful day.
Think I'll take advantage of it. I'll try not to feel guility.
Enjoy your day!
they know better then to poop on the head that feeds them.
Let's hope that these pics start the Prosecution of the Bush monsters who ordered this torturer to the full extent of the law.
So Joe Scarborough, Dick Cheney’s Appeaser thinks the moment President Obama took office, he has made this country less safe; this coming from a D- Law Student. Joe Scarborough should be looked upon with so much respect because he had the courage to join the military and who was able to fight right by his American Idol Cheney’s Side. So he knows up front how it is to sacrifice for your country; he knows firsthand how to go to battle with fellow brave soldiers’ right by your side because he has been there right?
It’s unfortunate that MSNBC allow this coward to come on national TV to site a poll that no one has ever seen. He is very good at showing polls when it is something negative against President Obama. My question is, where is Jealous Joe Scarborough’s poll at stating that 50% of American agrees with him. This poll is as bout as real as Joe Scarborough being an average or above Law Student; this poll is about as real as Joe Scarborough and Dick Cheney having the courage to serve in the military.
And since Joe Scarborough has seen the CIA Intelligence Report why not call him to speak in front of Congress so he can tell what he knows. Let the truth out Joe Scarborough since you are aware of some things the rest of the world does not.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/13/scar...
is a mindless dickhead.
Zbig Brezinski mopped the floor with him intellectually, and didn't have to break a sweat.
Joe Scarborough...oh...is he the guy that gets two hours of face time on MSNBC and spends the rest of his day writing copy?
of the late Lori Klausutis, a pretty young staffer who
was found dead in Joe's Office.
that doesn't think we engaged in abuse at Abu Ghraib, need only watch Taxi To The Darkside.
The images and videos that are seen in that documentary will turn the stomach of even the most callous individual.
Abuse? That doesn't begin to cover the level of atrocities that the Bush Administration was party too, and made the American People a party to.
http://www.dailykostv.com/w/001322/
Feingold says Cheney is wrong: ‘Nothing I have seen’ in the CIA memos proves torture was necessary.
He request all documents be released
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/05/13/feingold-...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdZqmbdt744&fe...
So do I.
Shine the light on it, let's have a REAL debate.
What is the Bush Admin afraid of? The terrorists are gonna get pissed off over our tactics?
Here's a newsflash, geniuses...they hate us already.
..is how this country will be ripped apart by a War Crimes trial against the previous administration. Yeah, America couldn't handle that. You know, like we couldn't handle Pearl Harbor, Korea, Viet Nam, Watergate, Iran-Contra, etc. ad nauseum. What the current administation needs to worry about is whether they'll be found complicit if they don't vigously persue the war criminals.
they'll be found something alright!
and therefore so would the American People if we do not make these prosecutions happen.
will be worse than complicit if they fail to investigate, prosecute, convict and punish for these war crimes and crimes against humanity.
They will be guilty of aiding war criminals after the fact.
US service members in Iraq and Afghanistan are most definitely NOT "protecting my freedom"!!! Quite the contrary!
What does Andy Gibbs have to do with Dick Hitler Cheney and the Republican Nazi Party
Mr.Gibbs: "potential detainee abuse in the past could have on the present-day service members that are protecting our freedom either in Iraq, Afghanistan, or throughout the world."
And HELL I was being kind in not hitting him over the "potential" meme!! When you have ACTUAL PHOTOS of the abuse there AIN'T no "potential" to it!!!
And once you began with Sleazebag I knew you couldn't be talking about Robert
.
Dear America,
Remember, Pictures are worth a thousand words...
... But grave sites of innocent victims killed by an illegal war are forever!
.
.
Dear America,
Did the release of these pictures cause 9/11?
.
The PNAC memos, Cheney secret energy meetings and neocons are the most likely cause.
I think it was nice of the Demblicans to keep a scrap book of their bi-partisan handiwork.
Recommended and Executed by Republicans. Excused and Pardoned By Democrats, knowing full well what was going on.
n/c
Well choreographed. Excellent timing Barack.
We didn't need to see those photos anyway. What with the market the way it is right now.
.
Less photos = happier times ahead?
But more grave sites of family members killed by illegal wars started by lies and perpetrated by enablers = less recruiting of terrorists?
.
............PUKIE!
How many "nothing to see here"s can Obama throw at us?
Does anyone really know what time it is?
Does any body really care?
Obama Blocks Release of Photos
Better link with story, Obama's explanation.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/05/13/wh...
"Obama would be the last to excuse the actions depicted in these photos," the official continued. "That is why the Department of Defense investigated these cases, and why individuals have been punished through prison sentences, discharges, and a range of other punitive measures.
"But the president strongly believes that the release of these photos, particularly at this time, would only serve the purpose of inflaming the theaters of war, jeopardizing US forces, and making our job more difficult in places like Iraq and Afghanistan."
let the cover-up continue
no matter what the intentions of the President...it LOOKS like a coverup...and reality is 95% perception.
the likes of Cheney, Bush, Rumsfeld, Yoo, Byee, and others ever torture in the name of America with a photographer present.
all cell phones and cameras will now be confiscated if you work in a detainee center.
No cameras on sale in the gift shop...but you can get an Official U.S. Army Regulation Water Boarding Throat Rag.
Wrong, Obama can be trusted to block their release.. Good man Barak way to rock it.
Only Jesse Ventura has balls around here...
...is reporting that, contrary to previous reports in the US media, the new photos will not be released by the Obama administration.
I guess.
WWDD?
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