Peggy Noonan says the Republican Party has a <i>Soul</i> problem!
By John Amato Saturday Jan 19, 2008 4:10pm
That's interesting coming from a person who helped re-elect the Bush/Cheney team and in my eyes is just as responsible for the GOP "soul" problem as anyone else. It was Peggy that said back in 2000: "we can’t afford another famous liar in the White House." Lying a country into war hasn't seemed to bother her all that much. Noonan carefully frames her criticism of BushCo starting in 2004 ---as if they suddenly changed after that election.
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Noonan: The Republican Party is trying to re-find its soul.
Robert Elisberg called Peggy out on HuffPo:
Unfortunately, Ms. Noonan, there is little hidden intelligence that Democrats haven't been yelling about publicly for years. There publicly were no WMDs in Iraq when we went to war - yet you made your "grand bargain" and still supported George Bush. The budget deficit and national debt were massive - and public - yet you and your Republican party made its "grand bargain" and supported tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. It was public that there were no links between Iraq and 9/11, but you made your "grand bargain" to support George Bush and blast as traitors and cowards anyone who dared say otherwise. And when an agent whose job was specifically to know more than others - and tell her superiors about that deep inside intelligence - was outed by people even George Bush last Thursday acknowledged were "probably" in his Administration - you Republicans had long-since made your "grand bargain" and defended the White House.
And then she complains about dynasties. Once again she forgets her role in perpetuating the Bush family dynasty. Peggy, if you think the Republican party does indeed have a soul problem, then I'd suggest you lead the way and if it's possible find your own soul first.
MS. NOONAN: May I just throw in here that I think the Republicans have a tough time this year. The Democratic Party is trying to figure out of two candidates which one will take them to success, take them to the White House. The Republican Party is trying to refind its soul. And in looking at each state, at each of these guys, they're thinking "is this the guy who reflects what conservatism is--what modern conservatism is, what this party is, and the next day they think, "maybe it's this guy." It is a much tougher thing to find your soul than it is to find success. So I think the Republicans are really going to be struggling for a while.
I also think, Jon, I must say, I think what has happened with the conservative coalition is that it has been sundered. I think it was sundered by this administration from 2004 on through a series of decisions that were not just at odds with, but deeply defined of and rejecting of the feelings, thoughts and views of Republicans and conservatives. And to make it even worse, the Congress, when it was under Republican hands and now Democratic hands, was just as defiant, just as at odds with the feelings of so many people about what it is that is most reflective of conservatism in the Republican Party. So I think Republicans have taken a beating in a way and they--I mean, almost a psychic beating, and they are trying really hard to redefine and come back. It's going to be a tough job.
MR. BROKAW: Republicans and Democrats alike. I have never heard as many Republicans, gold-star, born and bred Republicans, so unhappy with the management of this country by a Republican president now.
MS. NOONAN: Totally true.
MR. BROKAW: And I think that when she played the competence card and the experience card, it's measured against that.
MS. GOODWIN: Right.
MR. BROKAW: We don't want to go back into an unknown again. Here is somebody who does know what she's doing. That does pop up in the polls. But the counterweight to it, of course, is still not entirely comfortable with her. I have questions about her character and concern about whether she can win.
MS. NOONAN: May I say, dynasticism is part of this, too?
MS. GOODWIN: Oh, yeah.
MS. NOONAN: We haven't mentioned it, but there is this Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton--I've called it a sickness. It is an odd way for a great democracy to comport itself in this strange--we have dynasties now backed by lobbyists, backed by machines and machinery. The fact that America's doing this is giving so many people pause. It us unlike us. And I cannot help but think, as some people come forward and endorse on the Democratic side Mrs. Clinton, they must be thinking stop the dynasty. I know Republicans are thinking stop the dynasties.
MR. BROKAW: But on NBC, you'd be happy with Russert, Brokaw, Russert, Brokaw. That would be OK?
MS. NOONAN: Forever, Tom. Forever.
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And they need some more m****r f***ing tea!!
Listening to Noonan's claim that the Republican Party has a soul problem is like listening to someone claim that Satan is simply mis-understood and uses his evil to connect to his "good side". :lol:
2 Joe O.
I tried to get in touch with my inner child
But my inner CPS busted me.
The logical dissonance of the RW pundits is deafening sometimes...
A "soul problem"? Is that newspeak for "the GOP were caught red handed as the culprits of the the tidal wave of shit generated their own incompetence and lack of human qualities in their policies"?
I know where the republican's soul is if they're looking for it. In hell where it belongs!
How come the "Repbulicans" weren't concerned about stopping the Shrub dynasty before it ruined America ?
Shrub the 1st was a crappy president ; why would anyone envision that his son Chimpy , even more mindless , would be his equivalent at best ?
Yes, no soul...and no heart, no empathy, no nothing. Just hollow shells, walking/talking carbon-based units.
I can't watch these neo-cons anymore, especially hags like this one (hope you're reading this, you shrill b****).
Dynasties are only a sickness when it's a Democrat standing to have more than one shot at running things in less than 40 years time.
I've always found this Noonan character to be creepier than the average winger talking head...and that is way creepy.
I keep hearing from the current bunch of repugnant candidates that they are for 'Change', thet the current system is broken.
I just wish that some bobble head would pin them down as they appear in interviews, and ask: "What three things most need changing or fixing in the current administration?" and insist on he precise answer.
Then while they are at it, ask the 'tax-cutters' which past administrations added the most to our national deficit. The tax-cutters or others? What tax-cutter now running did not leave behind a deficit where they were mayoring or governing, and why not a single one has offered help to California's steroid inflated governator who is struggling with a deficit that he wants to balance by cutting school funds, help for the elderly and sick, and turn loose about 25,000 prisoners.
I would really like to see them answer
Is this Norman's mom
Before or after he stuffed her?
They will find it in hell.
We are now the United States of Arabia:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/20/opinion/20dowd.html?em&ex=1200978000&e...
The soul of the modern parties?
Dishonesty.
Sacrifice Others.
Initiative force, coercion and fraud
Extract values
A "greater good" by gunpoint
Distracting, slight-of-hand-magic tricks--
Present a bewildering array of good-seeming points
Divert attention from the real point
The Republican party has no soul and it never did.
It's nothing more than an affiliation of people who think money is the most important thing in life.
Peggy Noonan is a twat.
Yeah - they have a soul problem.....none of the incumbents have one!!!
They are all sociopaths - no conscience, paranoid, lacking remorse or shame,
glib and superficial, secretive, despotic tendencies and pathplogical liars.
Peggy Noonan seems to me to meet all the criteria herself....
If Noonan is looking for the Republican party's soul, she might do best to search around where Saddam Hussein currently resides. After all, Hussein and many in the Bush Administration were good friends.
A "Soul" problem?
What they have is an "arsehole" problem.
What the hell Peggy, lying about a BJ is so much worse than lying to the whole country and have thousands of Americans killed and god knows how many million innocent Iraqis.
These people make me sick!!!
Good and bad news ms. Noonan. The goods is, I found the GOP soul clinging to the side of my toilet bowl. The bad news is, well. you know what the bad news is.
The soul problem is:
They have only assouls to choose from.
14 CalGeorge
The funny thing is although I doubt there's a linguistic connection our word twat sounds like he Egyptian word tuat for the Underworld. They have a sacred book called the Am Tuat, a different set of scripture from The Egyptian Book of the Dead (although I prefer it's Theban title On Coming Forth Into the Day) TEBD was the title of the translator E A Wallis Budge (no relation to Siouxsie Sioux's Budgie.)
The Am Tuat described the Sun God's Ra nightly travels and travails though the sky in his Barque of a Million Years. They sky is divided into regions. It has one of the earliest descriptions of a firey underworld filled with boiling water, that Ra in His beneficense would rescue suffering souls from, and place in his barque to bring to a suitable island paradise in the sky, of which there were several. The Egyptian Book of the Dead venerated the god Osiris of the Underworld, who presided over the judgement of the dead, and assigned them to a suitable place for blessed or bane.
Praise Bob!
I'm not quite ready to brush paint the new Congress with this bullshit about how they have let down the American people. True, they seem to have little balls for a fight, but then again, they have a weak majority and a prick with the veto pen sitting up in the White House threatening to block any attempts they make.
I'm perfectly willing to wait until 2008, at this point in time, and give the Congress a solid majority and a Democratic administration WILLING TO WORK with Congress to get this ship righted. IF they don't take quick and decisive action after bush is tossed out (and hopefully locked up), then I'm calling for the hook.
I'd be more apt to call it a brain problem, looking at the people they have around now.
If there is an afterlife, and apologists, shills, and enablers for this vile president get there someway, the Founding Fathers are going to be waiting. This bitch is going to be in for some serious hurtin'.
STEVEinSC @ 24:
They didn't have baseball bats in 1776.
But I can tell you right now a cricket bat handled by an angry Founding Father could deliver some serious hurtin' power.
ysbaddaden @ 11:
Bates the hell outta me.
Noonan is one of those GOPers who are funding the cloning of Ronald Reagan. She worships him.
She's been as complicit in Bush's disasters as anyone. They're all deserting the ship now.
Peggy should be called driftwood since she's washed up
All of the MSM was screaming about the "Bush dynasty" in 2000. They were words like "coronation" used, and the Bushes were America's "royal family". Well, ain't gonna happen now, MSM. You don't get your king, or your royal family, or your f***ing dynasty.
ysbaddaden @ 21:
Hemp farmers unite!!
JaneaneTheAcerbicGoblin @ 27:
Not sure they're deserting the ship.
I suspect they're preparing for the future, a future that involves (with their help) a failed HRC presidency and the ascendancy of Jeb.
You know, if this L Ron Hubbard/Tom Cruise thing is true, maybe Peggy can cram some of Saint Ronney's purity of essence in her oven and then maybe something will pop out to come to the repukes rescue.
Gawd. Doesn't this just tell you everything we need to know about the media and the November campaign?
Hillary v. McCain. Ugh.
30 Jo
You into farmers bondage?
Whenever a parakeet says, "Polly wants a cracker," has anyone presented her with a Claude Hopper?
STEVEinSC @ 32:
She would have to purify her oven first or what pops out may be Rosemary's Baby on steroids.
jr @ 28:
That would explain why she's so shrivelled looking.
ysbaddaden @ 21:
Twat did you say? Ancient sky-boats traveling to heavenly islands? The ancients and their fanciful sky-ships. As if we were some kind of cargo-cult, creating religions from our impressions of a space faring culture.
ysbaddaden @ 34:
Only if the farmer looks like he means it and no, only Claude's mom, Hedda.
Isn't it interesting that those people who constantly blather on about "personal responsibility" rarely if ever display any of their own?Noonan typifies this sort of behavior.
Excellent Ms Noonan. You were able to give the same mindless dribble for the last 7.5 years. Is that off the top of your braiwashed head. Speak, speak and then repeat.
Purity of essence sounds like Philippus Aureolus Theophrastus Bombastus von Hohemheim's (also known as Paracelsus) Quinta Essentia, but generally known to most hermiticist as quintessence, the fifth life bringing element to the other four.
I have to admit to wanting to giggle at his name, because Aureolus sounds so much like aureole, the round part around the nipple. It also sounds like Oreo, but comes with it's own milk for dipping.
Jo @ 38:
Indubitably, if some one was born today with a name like Hedda, they would inevitably become a porn star.
The rethuglican party has a soul?
Not sure they’re deserting the ship.
I suspect they’re preparing for the future, a future that involves (with their help) a failed HRC presidency and the ascendancy of Jeb.
I think this could happen. If HRC runs a DLC, screw the base administration, the GOP will take over Congress in 2010 for sure.
As for Jeb, we'll see. The Bush name is major poison these days, and probably won't dissipate in the next 4 years.
That woman looks like a talking corpse!!!
Noonan is just one of the infinitude of republican hypocrites who have mindlessly supported the Bush administration, despite it's mendacious malfeasance. And together, they have attempted to tear the soul, the heart, the conscience, the reputation, the wealth, and the spirit out of this once-great nation.
They are well on the path to succeeding, one more administration by their party, with it's greedy self-interests as their priority, might just tip the balance and render the American dream a permanent nightmare, as has been experienced this past seven years.
By perverting the language, the principles, the morality of our people, in the hypocritical pretense of doing 'god's' will and work, they have mocked the dream of freedom and individual achievement for the body politic which was in the mind, the words, and the dreams of our founders. They have shunned the concept of a nation of law, they have ignored the principles of having a system of checks and balances, the guiding principle which makes a democracy possible, and differentiates it from dictatorial fascism.
They are looters, warmongers, ignorant, amoral, selfish graspers whose only purpose in life is to satiate their greed, not only for material things, but for their warped, megalomaniacal, conscienceless, ego satisfaction, without regard for others, in the delusion that they are the 'chosen' of their figmental 'god'.
Who, if he existed as they envision him, would truly be the anti-christ.
I know Republicans are thinking stop the dynasties.
...at least until it is Jeb's turn to run, right,
Peggy?
Can someone please point out the politics of the panel please. I couldn't pick a progressive out of the bunch. It looked a rightwing suckoff.
GOOD GOD, YES...that woman drove me nuts this morning to the point that we switched channels...but I'm betting that the next big slogan for the REPUGS is the old "finding their soul" crap...In fact the entire panel on MTP was sad, including the usually moderate Kerns-Goodwin...getting easier and easier to switch away from the pundits!
ysbaddaden @ 42:
Well, she was a republican so one would assume ( ass of u and me) she took a wide stance.
Ozguy @ 25:
I did note the OZguy moniker probably indicates you are Australian, and I would just like to offer my apologies for the megalomaniac troglodyte in the White House. I hope the rest of the English-speaking world will understand our pain and that sometime in the future we can regain a place of respect in that community. As for now, anything you can do to help us rid ourselves of this aberrant nightmare is appreciated.
First true statement out of that idiot's mouth.
30 Jo Says:
Hemp farmers unite!!
__________________________________________________________________
How did you know I'm really Woody Harrelson?
Heh...heh...heh...I said Woody.
Me go now.
Two to one. Two bushes, one Clinton
Lets even it up for karma.
Um, as someone else who was fascinated by Egyptology in my misspent youth, (and thereby the only one to giggle in the cinema when I went to see the original Stargate movie - Daniel Jackson correcting a mistranslated bit of text while muttering darkly, 'Budge has a lot to answer for'), I'm slightly familiar with the Book of the Dead. It's not quite the same concept of Heaven and Hell in our Judeao-Christian mindset; the 'hell' of the BOTD was more like a series of tests the dead had to undergo to get to the weighing of the heart - sort of like a Lara Croft Tomb Raider game for the Deceased.
Once you got through all the trials, then you had your soul assessed - win, you get to go to heaven. Lose, and you don't go to hell. No, the Egyptians had a better punishment - lose, and your soul is eaten, and you simply cease to exist, as if you'd never been born. A fate worse than death.
Just to exhibit my more nerdy side here...
Peggy Noonan has a soul problem. I heard her this morning purposely mispronouncing Barack Obama's name. Calling him, barrack (as in the place where soldiers sleep) and she did it repeatedly. I have heard her do this in the past as well. She is like the effete elitist who thinks that only she can do it correctly and that whatever she says - and the way she says it is right.
Now I say this not even really liking Obama. But it reminded me of GHWBush who continually and purposely mispronounced Saddam Hussein's name - as a sign of his disrespect. That is what Peggy Noonan does, and, I believe, why she does it.
She really ticks me off.
getalife @ 54:
Hey! That was Bubba's line.
For some reason, I have this image of the Republican Prez candidates converging no Motown lookin' fer their soul!!!!!!
Calling Bush's management of the presidency a disaster ... that's putting it mildly. The Republicans thugs in DC and on TV have no soul, no shame, no heart, no respect, no clue--except when it comes to moving money out of the hands of the poor and the middle class and into their own pockets. (For me however the good thing about this election season is hearing over and over how dirty and disgusting the Bush Crime Family's campaign practices were in the 2000 republican campaign. Unfortunately, it's a little too late.) All I can say is ... Fuck you Peggy (as-if-I-have-a-soul) Noonan and to all the talking heads. I'm sure your complicity has paid off well.
The Republican Party sold its soul to the devil in 2000 and reaffirmed the contract in 2004. The poor fools believe that they can reclaim their soul, but alas, it is gone forever, and splintered into a thousand pieces.
HulksHeroes @ 22:
again, I am late to the party, but just wanted to addk that the Rethuglicans have broken the record on filibusters for a Congressional session. I believe I heard/read this year's number was in the 60+ area.
If it walks and talks and calls itself a Republican, it filibusters any proposal by any Democrat.
Ozguy @ 25:
Sports were not a concern in the late XVIII century, however I am sure that a lot of the Founding Fathers were quit able with the sable.
37 Brad
As for the Polynesian Cargo Cults they were found forming in the aftermath of World War II, and seemed to provide the basis for Erich Von Daniiken's (sp?) Chariot's of the Gods. The only problem is Earth is in the boondocks of the boondocks. Our portion of the galaxy is far from the more dense center.
Space ships coming here to land is such a long-shot that it would be like our pulling into a gas station in the middle of no where, where the attendant is picking at his butt and smoking a cigarette, like in the beginning of one of my favorite movies Elvira: Mistress of the Park.
And Nonny-Mouse you were right about The Egyptian Book of the Dead. The condemned were sent to either the slaughtering block or were eaten by the monster Ammut, who stood beneath the scales during the weighing of the heart. However, much of what I was saying earlier was concerning a seperate set of doctrines, The Am Tuat, which had a hellish underworld and gates, but the EBD had primarily doors, pylons etc, which you had to know the name of and their guards before being allowed to pass.
So if Noonan is really a chameleon this is what she really is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3u3HQtv61M
nonny mouse @ 55:
I must say the Egyptians had better imagination in the Life and Death department. To have one's soul eaten - a fate worse than death. How less dramatic is our own "fate worse than death" - a woman's loss of virginity.
Dancer @ 49:
ahhh, Kerns-Goodwin. The woman who plagiarizes in her "scholarly works". I have no respect for that woman. I lost it when she acknowledged her stolen information and her using it as if it were her own.
I think they removed repug soul from Glenn Becks ass.
This blogsite needs to be like this:
There is an egg.
Everyone gathers around the egg and comments on it.
But if anyone offers a different opinion, wings flap, and beaks squawk, and the offender leaves the circle.
Purity of essence. Yes. On the right. On the left.
VietVet8666 @ 67:
??
I watched Peggy & Co on the round table Meet the Press, and was amazed at the level of bias on this panel which was not only limited to Peggy.
What amazes me and why I am very uncomfortable with a Obama candidacy is the fact that the Press (especially what I saw on Meet the Press today) are almost acting like "Defence attorneys" or "apologists" for Barrack Obama. I have nothing against Obama but honestly can't he speak for himself?
Who is Peggy to advise Dems about political dynasties in America? The Clinton dynasty i.e. Bill Clinton one was a successful dynasty as far I am concerned that put "bread on the table" for most Americans. FACT.
Are we Democrats that stupid or naive that we can allow the corporate owned media or the Reps to actually tell us who we should pick as our Democratic nominee? "Hillary has to many negatives". What does in the hell does that mean? If the Reps do not like her why should we care?
We have been reduced to a society of "simpletons" where how the candidates stand on the issues is not important. Instead it's a question of whether a candidate seems more likeable, has a "feel good" quality, someone you have a drink with etc. Remember what they said about GW? Look were we are today...Recess... Fill in the blanks.
ysbaddaden @ 63:
You're presupposing that distance is an obstacle (google exotic matter space time,) and that conscious beings are uncommon in the galaxy.
Steve, we ourselves have only just rejoined the community of sane nations, by booting out Bush's No. 1 toady on the world stage, John Winston Howard. A man who never saw a Republican arse he didn't want to lick.
I just hope that if war crimes trials ever come to pass for Bush and his co-conspirators, this detestable little grub finds his rightful place among the defendants.
STEVEinSC @ 51:
55 nonny mouse
I should mention that the Am Tuat never specified how long the torture would last. But generally historians see the eternal torment being a Christian refinement. Some historians say that cynically, but it seems to have appeared around the time of Constantine. If you broke his laws don't think you're getting away with just torture and execution but torture in the world to come for all eternity.
Even though the Old Testament mentioned Hell and fire, it was translated from Sheol (jail) and Gahenna, a former shrine to Moloch where the first born was burned alive as a sacrifice, but later used as a garbage dump by the Jews, and a place to dump executed criminals. It was more a place of death, not living death. Additionally, the Old Testament's favorite metaphor was of hewing away dead wood and other such agricultural garbage and burning them, the intent to be finished and done with it, not to have to watch the fire indefinitely.
Even Tantalus and Sisyphus weren't expected to be tormented forever. I suppose some think that ultimately they would be destroyed, and others might believe they would ultimately be reclaimed, kind of like a Purgatory.
At the risk of being off topic as parts of this thread are getting... 'The only problem is Earth is in the boondocks of the boondocks. Our portion of the galaxy is far from the more dense center...
Yah, that is correct. Earth is definitely toward the terminal end of a spiral arm of the Milky Way Galaxy. And if you talk to an astrophysicist, s/he might be able to explain better than I can (since I'm not an astrophysicist) why life isn't likely to be found at the dense centre of the galaxy - too much high intensity radiation. But since our galaxy has billions and billions (channeling Carl Sagan) of stars, and the universe has billions and billions of galaxies, chances are that even if the parameters for life is relatively narrow (yellow sun, earth sized planet a specific distance in orbit, water based, etc.), life is not unique to our one little planet.
That being said, the distance between possible habitable planets with intelligent life is like one bacterium in Los Angeles trying to reach another bacterium in Central Park. I'm not expecting little green men to show up on the White House lawn any time soon...
Although, with folks like Peggy Noonan, who needs aliens from another planet?
Tyler Durden @ 62:
"May 4, 1778: George Washington and cricket
George Washington even played the game himself.
"This day His Excellency dined with General Nox" wrote first lieutenant George Ewing in his diary, "and after dinner did us the honor to play at Wicket with us." Wicket was a type of informal cricket prevalent across America.
A festival match to commemorate an anniversary of the occasion was organized near Wayne's Woods below the Memorial Arch in the summer of 1993."
link
Brad @ 70:
I didn't say it was technologically impossible, but impractical. You're presupposing there is something of interest here for such travellers, that's why I used the metaphor of being in the middle of nowhere.
Since all the UFO stories seem to concern crop circles, and slaughtered cattle, it sounds like Grzzl and Glannk came all this way for a tailgate party.
Maybe the space critters like Grzzl and Glannk are like the ones from the TV show V. They want to ranch the human race to take the place of honor on their dinner tables, namely the entree plate.
And if we give them Peggy Noonan first, all that dessicated beef will give them food poisoning.
Republicans do have a soul problem. Most just don't have one, and they certainly have no heart. What we've learned the last 7 years is that conservativism just doesn't work, at least not for the majority of Americans. On an individual level, Bush was a predictable failure. He was a spoiled rotten rich kid with mediocre intellect, a puppet of the plutocracy, yet the rethugs/conservatives stood behind him while he wreaked havoc on the country and the world, while he made bad decisions, divided the country, and used fear to manipulate. And let's not lose sight of the fact that Bush was not acting alone, but in fact on the advice of conservative think tanks and the neocons in particular. Regardless of who the next president is, we should not let the country forget what a disgrace both Bush and Cheney were to the offices of the president and vice president.
#77, good post.
Drat it all, we're all out of grilled Dover sole!
Oh the vicissitudes of human existance!!!
Peggy,
There are other things missing along with a soul. The first was foresight. Foresight, available to most people, allows you to project into the future based on past behaviour. Yet, Republicans either didn't use or didn't have foresight available.
The other thing missing is the ability to listen. Republicans have refused to listen to reason & logic for many years now. Instead, justifying, obfuscating & blaming others for the ridiculous mess the U.S. finds itself in.
Peggy, based on the qualities that are missing, the best thing Republicans can do is either a. Cease to be republicans, because you're only getting in the way of getting good things done or b. Stop voting because you're only getting in the way of getting good things done.
=my2c
BC
73 nonny mouse Says:
I’m not expecting little green men to show up on the White House lawn any time soon…
__________________________________________________________________________
I'm sure Greenpeace will be so disappointed.
Of course, Peggy had no problem with any such "sickness" when Chimpy was about to be re-elected. What a disingenuous piece of filth she is.
Thank you Peggy. No more Bush Clinton Bush Clinton... there are more Bushes and Clintons to come. Nope notta no way
From Racist To "Dynastist?"
Okay, "dynastist" is not a word. I think you get what I am trying to say. Hillary Clinton just fought off nasty claims she was a racist. Since that did not work, the anti Clinton committee has switched to the very first negative associated with her bid for the president. The dynasty argument, at its root, is doing what the racist argument tried to do and that is to take away who Clinton is as an individual.
The media knows their viewers react to labels; they would not use them if this were not true. For whatever reasons, they think they can tell us you must put this candidate in this box called "racist" or "dynasty." In the case of the dynasty box, they have to first make the assumption the Clinton years were bad and, when you speak of them along side the Bush presidencies, it is no wonder you come up with a bad taste in your mouth.
Let the facts speak for itself. The Clinton years were not that bad, and I don't see any reason why we should judge Hillary as if she is a clone to nothing but what her husband did. When you say it, it makes no sense. I am sorry the logic does not add up. 12 years associated with the Bush family, which were very bad, and 8 years of Bill Clinton, in which there was prosperity, does not equal a back and forth. Nevertheless, the important point is Hillary is an individual, to be judged as a separate contribution to our government. She is not a label but a full human being with the right to be viewed as she presents herself.
Joseph
fuck brokaw. he was a busch suppporter and even claimed that busch won the "debates". he's just getting more air time because outside of Olberman, no one at any NBC has any credibility.
the fix is in. diebold will choose our next president to the thunderous confirmation by the media.
Noonan's comments about the Repubs needing to refind their soul, and the Shrub never really representing Repubs, reminds me of the comment heard from the religious-right when one of their own (often) does something low-down and dirty:
"Oh, he wasn't a True Religious-Right Christian"
When it happens enough, a smart person starts to question their ideology.
Joseph @ 84:
hillary had her billionaire surrogate play the 'race card' so she should get a pass, right?
her shit is right out of the repug playbooKKK and if her war stance is not enough, how about her support of LIEberman over Lamont?
'not that bad' doesn't read to me like a ringing endorsement. I don't want busch-in-a-dress.
CoIntelPro @ 87:
Didn't Hillary say just recently that she thinks Lieberman should be able to keep his committee chairs, which he has been doing nothing with? After all the crap Lieberman has put everyone through, Hillary is concerned about Lieberman's feelings.
Where was YOUR SOUL, Ms. Noonan, when Bush lied about McCain's "illigitimate child" in south Carolina?
Where was YOUR SOUL when Bush lied about yellow-cake in Niger?
Where was YOUR SOUL when Cheney outed Valerie Plame?
Where was YOUR SOUL when Gonzales moved to legalize TORTURE?
Where was YOUR SOUL when Dennis Hastert protected a child molester in Congress?
Where was YOUR SOUL when Brownie was doing a "heck-of-a-job" after Katrina.
Where was YOUR SOUL for the six years of NO OVERSIGHT from Republican leadership?
You've got a lot of damn gaul to cry about the loss of the soul of the Republican party now... after the most corrupt and vile American administration IN HISTORY... and the part THAT YOU PLAYED IN IT.
The only thing worse than a has been Reaganite, is a drunken has been Reaganite.
Besides... what Peggy Noonan SAID was that the Republican candidates were looking for the soul of the Republican Party...
Which is BULLSHIT. The Republican candidates are PANDERING to splintered constituencies in the most base and repulsive way. THEY KNOW THEY ARE DOOMED, and they know they did it to themselves.
This coming from the person who wrote Reagans speeches.
CoIntelPro @ 87:
"Not that bad" was not meant to be a ringing endorsement. Your are why I wrote what I wrote. I have the right not to place people in a "box." Labels don't define the total person; they are, at best, a snapshot in time. I am not privileged to how Hillary Clinton and Joseph Lieberman built their relationships, and I am not going to base my whole opinion of a person on an endorsement.
We don't live in a perfect world. I did not like the endorsement,in which I heard with my own ears, Barack Obama gave Ronald Reagan yesterday. Yet, I am not going to base my whole opinion of him on that endorsement. Some feel it is much easer to call a person a member of the KKK and associate them with something or somebody very unpopular, and in doing so, they assume we all agree with their labels. I am not a sheep; I don't follow someone's adolescent form form of judging others.
Most of all remember this. Hatred has no place in the primary election process. In the end, if the Democrats don't remain together, they are divided. "Together we stand; divided we fall." Barack will have to include Clinton's supporters to win in the general election. Or Hillary will have to include Obama's supporters in the general election. If we take the hatred road, this important connection will not be made.
Joseph
Joseph @ 93:
hate is good for yah it strengthens your cornholee poll and it makes republicans screem in agony!!!!!!!!!!
Joseph @ 93:
screw them both ill tale edwards and edwards can tell hillary and obama to kiss hiss ass!
take damit
The impression I get from hearing the way Noonan pronounces Barack, ba-rack, is she's a racist and not worth paying attention to.
ysbaddaden @ 75:
Ancient ET's motivation?
Need for gold. Where is the lost republican soul? Why do we stockpile gold, now an exciting "new" foundation for exotic matter technology, but not do an inventory?
"According to the Federal Reserve Richmond branch Gold certificate issues (redeemable in gold) of 1934 were issued to the Federal Reserve in 1934, still held by the Fed, but were declared illegal for all others in FDR’s gold confiscation scheme of 1933; in effect, committing the people's confiscated gold to a cartel of private bankers."
http://www.knology.net/~bilrum/Paul_Prohibit_Banks.htm
Noonan has no right to complain about "famous liar(s) in the White House' : after all she wrote speeches for Reagan, who was about as full of it as Mitt Romney. Reagan of course is defended because he "sincerely believed in" every untrue thing he ever said. I guess Conservatives must tell their children the story of young George Washington and how he "sincerely believed" he didn't cut down that cherry tree. This is a political movement without a soul, or virtue, or values at all. People like Noonan are a "movement" in the most unfortunate sense of the word, and she and the rest of them, neo-cons, paleo-cons, social-cons, whatever, need to be flushed from our government, our TVs, our entire system. Let them go about their lives, but they've clearly shown they should never ever, ever be allowed in charge of ANYTHING. Can't remotely balance a budget. Can't find Osama. Can lie. Can smear. Can borrow, borrow, borrow. Can lie some more. Smear some more, steal some more. Worthless, worthless movement. FLUSH 'EM ALL!!!!
Joseph #93,
I agree with you completely.
You know some people just don't get it especially some of our overzealous folks in the Democratic Party.
It's this same kind of "my way or the highway" thought process which some of them have, that has made the GOP outsmart us in the past time and time again.
A 'soul' is something a priest sells you in order to tax you 10% on your proceeds.
BC @ 80:
She thought it was 'foreskin,' and post-clitidorectomy, she's got no problems in that area.
No sensation, either, but that's the price of 'success' in evil -- numbness.
She doesnt mean a soul in the way you think, she means they dont have a coherent political philosophy.
Peggy Noonan has an IQ problem!
Bill Clinton told a little lie, a self-serving little lie.
George told a lot of very big, very nasty, very destructive lies.
They're both liars.
Don't lie.
Don't do anything you're going to need to lie about.
That's soul.
The rest is unctuous horse dung.
The Repubs have no soul. They sold it to the devil long ago.
Ah, yes, the ongoing search for the Repugnican soul.
Let us all know how that one goes, won't you Peggy Sue?
And BTW, Peg, while you're on the hunt.
It's just a wee point but still, one must wonder how the vampire can complain about sucking the soul out of the corpse once the blood's all gone...but, please tell us all.
Just how does one keep a the fangs in cheek while killing all those dynasties?
After all, it's dynasty you're after, isn't it?
I mean, after all, you are a soul-searching Repugnican, are you not?
I can't STAND this pompous, self-important bozo. She's a holier-than-thou cretin who lives happily in her own private echo chamber. Her rationalization of Republican mendacity knows no limits.
Peggy Noonan reminds me a lot of a catholic girl I went out with when I was a student. She was sweet, conscientious and funny, but moralistic, petty and judgmental. She pretended to be broad-minded and well-read, but was actually narrow-minded and disdainful of anyone who didn't fit her petty prejudices. She was flirtatious, but refused to put out. She was a pain in the ass.
She dares to talk about the soul of her party? When she herself long ago embraced Bush's tax welfare scheme for the richest 1%? When she has nothing to say about the manifest trashing of US constitution? When she was an enthusiastic booster of the 'Save Terry Schaivo' charade?
This woman has no more soul than a toilet seat.
Trying to re-find their soul? Did these a-moral war mongering America haters ever have a soul?
Isn't just soo odd and coincidental that Noonan feel that the Bush/Clinton Bush/Clinton dynesty thing has just got to stop. ??
She didn't seem to think that when she supported this episode of twightlight zone starring George Bush and Dick Cheney with a cast of little people at no expense, now did she?
Just makes you wonder if Jeb Bush was in the race what she would be saying? That Noonan episode is actually a rerun................................................
All the GOP needs to find is honesty. There is none in anything they do. To find honesty does not require a soul, but does require humility.
Noonan loves the sound of her own voice and the GOP has no soul. Simplisticly, this was a Noonan eulogy.
Poor Peggy, every time she makes an appearance, she pukes her inner soul over the unsuspecting, unknowing, unfeeling airways. I am left reeling.
This unctuous cretin is one of the most disgusting pieces of drek to infect the airwaves. Even the other guests seemed to be regarding her is if something nasty scraped from the bottom of their shoe had been placed at the same table with them. Her voice is annoying, her points are pitiful and her rhetoric is nothing anyone of intellect or integrity would find interesting. Now that I've listed her good points I'll have to think of something negative to say about this pitiful twit.
"Peggy, if you think the Republican party does indeed have a soul problem, then I’d suggest you lead the way and if it’s possible find your own soul first."
HERE HERE!!! Truer words were never spoken. I cannot stand that coniving greaseball known as Peggy Noonan. She absolutely makes my bones quiver with her deception and 'sophosticated lies'. Her whole thing is wrapping her reich-wing agenda and propanganda in intellectual sounding phrasing intended to coax the viewer or reader into percieving her rhetoric as deep, and wise, well-reasoned and prudent. Well I've got news for you, she is a wolf in sheeps clothing. I've been reading and watching her for years, and it is as transparent as the light of day that she is just another ThugliCon shill. Take every word she so theatrically forces upon the audience in this clip, and see how each word is strategically and intentionally chosen to cheerlead for the ThugliCons, decietfully, as if they were independent ideas. She is a total and complete ThugliCon operative who is erroneously given credibility and respect as a more independent political commentator-- she is not. She is reTugliCon operative through and through-- make her own it.
Wow, gee her passionate theatrics about dynasties didn't even peek through when it was Bush II turn to run TWICE!! And can't you just bet, that if Jebby-Jeb were in this race she wouldn't even think of making such an argument. These are the traits of a hardened shill, here Peggy Noonan. Just lying through her teeth trying to create an alternate universe where George Bush's primary violations took place- wait for it... distinctly AFTER the 2004 REelection of the jester by the baffoons. Give me a fucking break lady. That this sort of trash is even allowed to be peddeled in a 'serious political analysis' is a mockery of the integrity of all those present, and they own that as well. If ThugliCons actually held themselves accountable for the consistency of their blathering to the same degree that they hold teachers accountable for the learning of children (against all odds in poor classrooms of 48 students) then there would be nothing to prevent the wieght of the real universe from collapsing in on the implosion of their empty heads and the empty rhetoric of their party in a cosmic spectacle of annihilation.
Peggy Noonan is a purebred snakeoil salesman, despite that she wears a dress, or in this case a shiny leather jacket. Got it? Good. God I can't stand the deceit of that 'lady'.
Annoyed Canuck @ 108:
Very well said, Canuck. To be fair, Noonan's published prose does show some natural talent at putting words together - but alas, she is a cretin with no soul.
And listening to her talk on TV goes way beyond annoying. She has that habit of always, always talking in a hushed, solemn tone - as if absolutely every word she utters, no matter how trivial or stupid, is full of deep and profound significance.
By the way, a hefty, hefty cheers to kenoshaMarge for this:
kenoshaMarge @ 114:
Simply, elegantly brilliant. It took me so many words to try and say what you were able to in so few.
TM @ 116:
To the both of you, brilliant. What a relief to hear others describe my feelings even better than I can.
I'll continue in primitive form: eeeeaaaagggghhhhhululululuulaaaahhhh.......
The Repub Party has a brain problem. That is their major deficit.
kenoshaMarge @ 114:
Unctuous cretin. Nice!
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